If you go to a reputable hardwoods lumber yard, you can buy your lumber 'in the raw' which is not bad as it sounds. You buy 4/4 oak for instance. If it is already finish milled it will look pretty but it is as you say, only 3/4, If you buy it un-milled it will be 4/4 or actually a full inch thick. The extra finish ,milling cost more.
One of your options is to do as I do, ask them to mill it until one side looks 'done' and stop. You will still pay for the extra milling but you will end up with usually one good side and one a little rougher at about total of 7/8: thick. This will allow you to edge glue and still have that extra 1/8" to level it all out at home with your own planer.
The reason I say 'mill it till one side looks good' is because the larger operations have planers that plane both sides at the same time so there is no choice in the matter. BTW, this is referred to as S2S which means milled 'Surfaced 2 Sides'
If you dont have a jointer, you would also ask for 'Straight Line Ripped' which will rip one edge perfectly so you wont have to deal with it at home.Si
If you want both of the above, you would ask for S3S - Surfaced 3 Sides.
Hopefully, you have a reputable hardwoods supplier with an hour or so from your home.
Mine is right at an hours drive each way so I plan my purchases with plenty of spare. Dont want to drive all the way back pfor one board.if I screw up.

 

One more thing. If you are not comfortable with the whole S2S, S3S thing, just speak in plain English and tell them exactly what you want. They are very understanding.

 

Thanks for the advice!! I am familiar with all the terms and understand them, sounds like I have to find the closest lumberyard near me. That's been a challenge so far. I do have a local Rockler store, maybe they can give me a lead on the nearest lumber yard

 

Rockler or Woodcraft would be a good start.

If no success, find out who the best cabinet maker in your area is. Don't call, just drive on over and talk to the owner/manager and I'm sure he will tell you who his source is.

 

There's also a Woodcraft near me too, looks like a cool place! I did find a couple lumberyards near me also, the most promising one is about an hour away, so not too bad!! There's a couple more really close but one is wholesale only, and the other specializes in live edge lumber with a small selection of dimensional lumber. I'll check them all out and see what's what. Thanks so much for the advice!!

 

If you don't mind sharing the city/state you're from, someone may be able to give you a source for lumber. Unless I need something "exotic" I try to avoid Rocker and Woodcraft simply because the crazy prices don't match the quality. I buy mostly from a cabinet supply wholesaler and most of their 4/4 S2S domestic's run around 7/8" - 15/16.

 

You want to finish at 13/16.

 

This is pretty much the standard for S2S 4/4 lumber from a Lumber yard or Supplier. Some of the Home centers sell S4S(surfaced 4 sides) that is actually 3/4", I wouldn't use it, the cost is prohibitive to begin with.

IMO unless you are well set up to process rough lumber saw yourself the headache and effort, buy S2S R1E(Surfaced 2 sides, Ripped straight edge 1 side), your life will be much better.

 

Interesting, why the extra 16th? To account for sanding? Again, I'm new at this and would like to soak in all the tips and tricks

 

We think 3/4 is a standard but in reality it isn’t. When you run the profile but, you usually get a better result with 13/16.

Yes, buy from a commercial supplier. Typical “4/4“ surfaced lumber (S2S) is 13/16”, sometimes 15/16. But 13/16 still doesn’t leave you any room for jointing or removing mill marks. But you take what you can get, buying 13/16 you‘re usually end up with 3/4. If they carry rough, that’s the best way to go. In a perfect world, I like a 7/8 thick door.

Choosing lumber seems simple, but trust me, when you get in there, take your time and focus on straight boards. It’s a good idea to check with the supplier and see what widths and lengths they have before applying a cutlist. I use Cutlist program to give me an idea how many boards, then I buy 20% more. If you live an hour away, make it 30%. You get the lumber home, you start laying out and cutting to rough dims, and don’t ask me why but you run out of lumber every time!

Wide boards will yield rift sawn for the longer stiles. That’s more stable wood. Always mill a few more longer stiles and rails than what you need b/c wood has a way of getting “rascally“ (releasing stress) overnight. Use them for set up pieces.

If you plan on doing much of this, I can’t say enough how a a drum sander will change your life!

 

Thanks for the advice, I've bought a lot of the tools I've seen used the most, and sanders were next on the list. Belt sander, shaping sander, etc. What part of the cabinet making process do you use the drum sander for? Is it for thickness purposes, or is it for finishing purposes, or perhaps both? If it's for finishing, do you run the stiles, rails, center panels through individually, or run it through as an assembly? Again I'm new to this, and really appreciate all the input you guys have given! Hopefully I'm not asking too many dumb questions! 😁

 

No problem. Disclaimer: I am not a professional cabinetmaker, not do I own a cabinet shop. But I think I can make a pretty good cabinet door, only b/c I've messed enough of them up and invested in some decent machines. There are others here who are, and they will come from a production perspective, which doesn't always translate to the hobby shop. But basic principle are the same.

I run the rails and stiles through the drum sander to get rid of milling marks. Not necessary, I just like having the wood surfaced prior to routing. I run the assembled doors again to flush every thing up. Then hit it with a random orbital. Only for flat panels. You can do it with raised panels but only if they are flush with rails/stiles, personally I don't like the look of "non-raised" raised panels, but factories do it.

My advice is don't buy a belt sander unless you want to ruin your project. Buy the best random orbital you can afford. Good sandpaper & dust collection very important. I hand sand everything prior to painting or finishing b/c those pesky curly Q's or swirls will magically appear in a finished door, especially if you're staining. I also hand sand all the profiles prior to assembly, and knock the sharp corners off the grooves.

There's a lot to know, some of it comes by trial and error based on what machines you have. When running profiles (bit with groove), do the first pass about 1/32" deep. This just about eliminates tear out. Also, if you leave your rails about 1/4" over sized ad the stiles about 1/4" long, then after assembly you have some meat left to square them up, plus you get a nice flush joint on the top and bottom. Takes a lot of stress out of the glue up.

You can get your feet wet making shop cabs. Just remember always have extra parts for the "oops" and to get your set up right. You need a good router table set up and a coping jig.

 

Around this area rough sawn lumber has always been difficult to come by. Therefore most(actually all) of the lumber that I have bought for furniture projects has been s2s or s4s. I have never had a problem with any of the boards being warped or "crooked." There has only been one lumber yard in this area to carry hard woods. Maybe they have just been good at buying.

My message is, do not go in looking for the bad. Look for the good and maybe you will find it.

george

 

Thanks for all the help and advice guys! I think I invested in a good router lift, I got the Rockler pro lift and router fence, with feather boards and all the accessories. Routed out and mounted it in the workbench I built so it's flush with the surface, with T-track all around it. Hopefully it will do the job! I'm excited to jump in and give it a go

 

13/16 is the thickness we order it from the cabinet supplier. When we run parts through the cutters and assemble doors we need enough to sand both sides through a overhead. Same way with face frames.

When I run my doors I try and split the 1/16 to give some sand on front and back.

Raised panels..... if not using a back cutter we order 11/16 and glue and sand to 5/8.

A door set is figured for 1/8+1/4+1/4+1/8 finished.. if my stock is 13/16 I've given my self some wiggle room if parts aren't perfectly flush to each other. Now I have some sanding rioom..

 

You won't see any 4/4 boards around here milled to 7/8-15/16

 

Interesting. We'll sometimes see 13/16 but never less. Where I buy it's not really "finish milled" more like skip-planed, maybe 90% of the saw marks gone. They don't mill it in house, it comes from their supplier already "surfaced".

 

13/16 is clean 2 sides here. It had to ready to hit the saws...

 

That's why we buy 300+ feet at a time..

 

Soft maple is through the roof by me. I have to pay yard prices since I moved and they are now up to $5.50 bd ft. freaking ridiculous.

 

As Tony stated I prefer to get my lumber rough sawn. 4/4 should be at approximately 1". It can vary some depending on drying. This may be overkill, but this is the process I have always followed for furniture or casework, it has never steered me wrong. Rough cut your lumber to dimension. I write on the end cuts, or lumber crayon on the tops. I do this because there are times I want to put the lumber back together in a particular order. As an example the left drawer and right drawer should come from the same board and put back together in that order, same faces out. These are the little things that make a big difference in the end. If it is paint grade, it does not matter. I then joint one face, and one edge perpendicular. I rip parallel edge and a pass or two through the planer. All dimensions should be larger than your finished lumber at this point. I then sticker the lumber for at least 24 hours to let the tension settle. I then go through the same process bringing the lumber to the finished dimension. The only ones I do not do this to are ones that will be glued up to make panels such as furniture tops, sides, or door fields. Those I try to keep at around 7/8". After glue up to the panels or fields I plane them to final thickness. Depending on the wood I sometimes try to do the face frames the same day. Even with slowly releasing the tension some woods, such as hard maple, can twist in the time it takes to eat a sandwich. The final thickness I use is often dictated by the quality of the lumber I am starting with. I prefer to work with 13/16, but sometimes I just can't squeeze that out of all the boards, in which case I do 3/4. Really makes no difference. My face frames I still do as mortise and tenon. Door frames I do cope and stick on a spindle shaper. Panels are raised on a spindle shaper. The biggest thing you can do is find a method that works for you that gives you consistent results. Everything from process, to machine set-up. I constantly check my machines for accuracy. Even with that, when I glue up panels I run opposing faces against the fence of my jointer when squaring edges. This way, if the fence is out at all, it will always compensate for itself.

 

Thanks for the advice! Especially stickering the lumber for 24 hours, I didn't think to do that. I have heard of running opposing faces while jointing, so this reinforces that I must do it in case the fence isn't a perfect 90

 

BColl gave an excellent post. My hats off on M/T face frames, I use pocket screws. No clamping, no wait time. That said, IMO frameless is the only way to go in a kitchen.

Once you get rolling, it’s easy to forget about stress relief in KD lumber. Always assume a board will misbehave, at least for the first few days. Patience pays off - always mill lightly (1/32) and evenly, mill up extra material. I do 2 7/16” R & S (I’ll explain in a minute). I rip all the sides rough to 3” that may be overkill, but it keeps me safe.

Paint vs. natural wood. With natural wood you pay more attention to grain pattern in the panels, bookmatching on wider panels is a mark of good craftsmanship. Use the flat sawn material for panels and rift sawn for R & S. Always leave you rails and stiles wide to allow for an oops when milling or a bowed board. If you get tear out rip 1/16 off and re route.

The lumber is one of those things I’ve learned to ”pick, pucker and pay”. I’ve been a few times where there was none or the stacks so low it was worthless. About 6 months ago I paid about $4 for 15/16 soft maple.

Using a bit set that makes a 7/16 deep groove, by sizing the stiles and rails 2 7/16, then all I need to do is subtract 4” from door width to het rail length. I learned that trick from Marc Sommerfeld. BTW he’s got some good videos on face frames and cabs.

 

Thanks for the advice! I'll definitely check out Marc's videos, Ive spent hours, I bet, watching videos so far!