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Thumb Nailer
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So the quandry is at hand. There seems to be NO 5" plastic duct, and shy of spending $40.00 per wye, sheet metal wyes for 5" are more or less non existent.

I see Woodcraft has their wood river branded 5" wyes going for around $13.00 each, which is awesome. And reducers and such can easily be sourced, but 45s are all but non existent, and again, no plastic pipe, so we are left with...

5" snap lock duct is readily available, as are adjustable elbows, and reducers, all at very reasonable prices, but then we hit the wyes, and boy are they steep at $40.00 a piece.

My question is. Can the ABS plastic fittings be mixed with the sheet metal duct and adjustable elbows to come up with a complete system?
 

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I'm also very curious.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
I'm also very curious.
This issue has me leaning toward eventually going to 6" duct for my main, but I am not really interested in replacing my Harbor Freight dust collector. With the Wynn filter and Wen impeller, it should support a 6" duct, but I know it will support a 5", which is why I am looking more toward 5" main, and just dropping to 4" at the tool...

The HF 2HP DC is far from unique in this, and according to the Pentz charts if I remember right, 5" is recommended for 2HP blowers, so my plan here is to... (Tracing from the blower OUT to the far end of the system as it were...)

  1. Come out of the blower 5" port via an adjustable elbow set at 45 degrees, a 2ft pipe segment to get to the wall, and another adjustable elbow set at 45 degrees.
  2. Come out of the elbow with a 5x5x5 wye. Would STONGLY prefer metal over plastic, but will do plastic if I must, branch facing up. another elbow at 45 degrees, and pipe segment going up the wall to the ceiling,
  3. Transition from wall to ceiling via a long sweeping 90, or 2 elbows set at 45 degrees each.
  4. Travel down the wall, and accross the ceiling, breaking out with another 5x5x5 wye, pipe segment, 5x4 reducer, and blast gates at the major tool locations. Thinking about moving the existing 5x4x4 wye to the end with the table saw to get better collection at the saw top and belly pan / blade shroud port.
As has been mentioned by me, and LOTS of other folks as well, the biggest issue being faced isn't the collector machine itself, nor even so much the ducting, but rather the ports on the machines themselves. Tool manufacturers, particularly consumer grade tool MFGs tend to put massively undersized dust ports on their machines, and rarely, if ever is there an option avaialble to easily upsize the port itself. We are LUCKY if we get a 4" port, most of our machines either have non port at all for dust collection, OR we get a 2.5" or smaller collection port.
 

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Don't be so quick as to settle for the HF DC without some mods, before you go messin' with the ducting!
Lot's of folks on You Tube have replaced the HF impeller with the Rikon, a larger one. I'm not certain whether the vanes are reversed on that one for a better push of the air?


These won't be cheap, but they will have what you need. I don't see mixing metal with ABS as a big problem, but there may be technical reasons not to do it?



Possibly cheaper?
 

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Large DC pipe and fitting are expensive. If you want or need it , pull the card..
 

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This was the site I was browsing last week...I had to search through my browsing history to find it...they have reasonable prices on 5" vent but I'm not sure the shipping costs.

 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Don't be so quick as to settle for the HF DC without some mods, before you go messin' with the ducting!
Lot's of folks on You Tube have replaced the HF impeller with the Rikon, a larger one. I'm not certain whether the vanes are reversed on that one for a better push of the air?

These won't be cheap, but they will have what you need. I don't see mixing metal with ABS as a big problem, but there may be technical reasons not to do it?


Possibly cheaper?
You might have missed my multiple posts about it. My HF 2HP DC is fitted with a Wen12" impeller that BARELY fits in the housing, a Wynn 35A filter, and a Pentz recommended neutral vane. Some folks are upsizing to 6", my run is 18' max, I am simply concerned with it being effective through the whole system. I KNOW 5" will work... 6" MAY work, but is really pushing it kind of hard... And no I do not have a separator in from of the blower. I didn't want the bottle neck there. For now staying with the neutral vane and blowing the filter down at the end of the day to keep it clean.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
This was the site I was browsing last week...I had to search through my browsing history to find it...they have reasonable prices on 5" vent but I'm not sure the shipping costs.

I am unfamiliar with Shell Hardware, but they sell the Imperial manufacturing GV0989 5x5x5 45 degree branch wye for under $30.00 per unit. Not sure about the shipping, but when you consider the price of the Wood River ABS plastic piece. If it came down to it, I will order one, and try to do a dry fit between that and standard snap lock 5" pipe and fittings. I know 4" works with no real issues other than crimps need to be gone over a little extra on the internals to get the fit right... No big deal. I would think 5" would be similar. Even if I had to, well... convince the 5" pipe to take the ABS I am pretty sure I could do it easily...

At worst, a couple of snips, a little careful stretching, and a few extra wraps of aluminum HVAC tape...

To heck with it. I have 5" snap lock pipe right now. Woodcraft has the 5" ABS 45 degree branch wyes on sale for $12.36 each, and there is a free shipping coupon code that ends today or tomorrow. I just bit the bullet and snagged a half dozen of these things. Guess I am committed to doing the mix between ABS and galvanized now...
 

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To heck with it. I have 5" snap lock pipe right now. Woodcraft has the 5" ABS 45 degree branch wyes on sale for $12.36 each, and there is a free shipping coupon code that ends today or tomorrow. I just bit the bullet and snagged a half dozen of these things. Guess I am committed to doing the mix between ABS and galvanized now...
FWIW, I had no problems connecting 6" snap lock to 6" PVC DWV wyes. The female openings on the wyes were too large for the pipe, but a short sleeve of 6" PVC pipe made a good transition to the snap lock. The snap lock ends needed some crimping.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
FWIW, I had no problems connecting 6" snap lock to 6" PVC DWV wyes. The female openings on the wyes were too large for the pipe, but a short sleeve of 6" PVC pipe made a good transition to the snap lock. The snap lock ends needed some crimping.
I expect, but I COULD be wrong, and I will certainly post my results, but I expect that the male side of the 5x5x5 wyes SHOULD slip into the female / smooth ends of the snap lock pipe. I likewise expect to have to de-crimp via vice grips and wooden cauls, the crimped male ends of the snap lock pipe and adjustable elbows...

It's going to take me a while to slowly gather up the stuff, but the plan is to just go with it. The wyes and reducers will likely end up being ABS, transitioning to snap lock mains should be fine, and the spurs at the machines then after the reducer are DWV PVC already and plan on using that.
 

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I just picked up 2 5" wyes from woodcraft and a couple 5" snap lock and stan pipes from HD

@dbhyou and I will be in it together
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
I just picked up 2 5" wyes from woodcraft and a couple 5" snap lock and stan pipes from HD

@dbhyou and I will be in it together
In for a penny, in for a dollar I guess right? Hmmm. That saying may be a bit old now that I think of it. Blame my Grandpa...

I actually have a plan to squeeze it all in the budget without hitting the card as it were.

#1. This week I snagged the the Wyes,
#2. Next week, grab the 5" snap lock pipe.
#3. In 2 weeks, grab a fresh spool of aluminum HVAC tape. I have a little bit left but I am gonna need a lot more, grab the elbows and reducers. For now I am going to use my just opened spool of duct hanger strapping / tape...

Once I get the installation squared up and 100% sure where I want it all, then I MIGHT or MIGHT NOT buy proper 2 hole strapping.

Having gone through all of this, I will end up with a bunch of 4" DWV stuff that I will need to offload when I am done.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
Good day. For those that are following along, My 5x5x5 wyes came in today, and the size isn't perfect,

Basically they will fit INSIDE of either the smooth, OR crimped 5" end with more slop than I am comfortable with.

I am planning on picking up a cheap roll of duct tape, and give the ends about 3 to 4 wraps of duct ttape to give it a snug fit.

IF you are doing a 5" system and need to reduce to 4", look at Grizzly, the Woodstock 5x4 reducers are going for $2.25 each.
 

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That's interesting because my 5" dnaplock fits perfectly over the woodcraft 5" wye
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
That's interesting because my 5" dnaplock fits perfectly over the woodcraft 5" wye View attachment 434855
Oh it fits, it's just a SLOPPY fit... I am aiming for a nice tight rattle free fit. Are you saying you get a snug fit with your snaplock? If so what brand snap lock is yours? I am using the Master Flow 5" Snap Lock galvanized pipe from Home Depot. I know Lowes carries Imperial MFG. Is that different?
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
So the breakdown of the materials needed / purchased or pending purchase and where did I get it from... The list will be item, QTY, cost per unit, and where I found them.

#1. Woodriver 5x5x5 branch wye. QTY 6. $12.36 from Woodcraft
#2. Woodstock 1037 5x4 dust collection reducer. QTY 8. $2.25 at Grizzly
#3. MasterFlow 5" x 5' snap lock pipe. QTY 8. $10.80 at Home Depot.
#4. Masterflow 5" adjustable elbow. QTY 8. $4.98 at Home Depot.
From this point down, I am repurposing my old stuff, so QTY and prices might be VERY hazy.
#5. Charlotte Pipe 4" DWV 10' joint. QTY 1 $10.98 Lowes
#6. Charlotte Pipe 4" DWV branch wye QTY 3 $7.78 Lowes
#7. 4x2.5 Y adapter / reducer. QTY 1 $11.99 Rockler
#8. Taytools 4x2.5 branch wye. QTY 1. $10.98 Amazon
#9. Fuzzy on these, but current market. Powertec 4in aluminum blast gate 6 pack. QTY 1. $59.49 Amazon
#10. 4" x 50' clear PVC dust collection hose. QTY 1. $89.95 Peachtree Woodworking Supply.
#11. 4" Wire hose clamps. QTY 12. $1.25 Peachtree Woodworking Supply
#12. Charlotte Pipe 4" DWV 45 degree elbows. QTY 12 $2.58 Lowes.
#13. Picked this number due to some folks triscadecaphobia. So I will put Aluminum HVAC tape. Nashua Tape. 1.89" x 50yd HVAC foil tape. QTY 1. $8.98 Home Depot.

I am sure I am missing stuff. 4x2.5 funnel reducers, 2.5" wire clamps, 2.5" hose etc... But hopefully you get the idea.
 

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Oh it fits, it's just a SLOPPY fit... I am aiming for a nice tight rattle free fit. Are you saying you get a snug fit with your snaplock? If so what brand snap lock is yours? I am using the Master Flow 5" Snap Lock galvanized pipe from Home Depot. I know Lowes carries Imperial MFG. Is that different?
Mine is tighter than yours. The male end will not fit over the fitting.
 

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all the intermediate sizes like 3,5,7 are almost non-existent. like at Lowe's, Home Depot , several of the major distributors. when I check just recently. we are now have to change the diameters to accommodate changes do to unavailable products.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
all the intermediate sizes like 3,5,7 are almost non-existent. like at Lowe's, Home Depot , several of the major distributors. when I check just recently. we are now have to change the diameters to accommodate changes do to unavailable products.
For what it's worth Tees are easily available, however I want a 45 degree branch wye in orde to avoid tight 90 degree turns.

The ONLY reasonably available I found is the Imperial GV0989, the lowest price I can find is from Shell Lumber for $29.45 which is well over double the cost of the ABS units, and pretty much everywhere else runs for $39.99. Oneida has their version for a little over $40.00 a pop.

Let's be blunt. If you are plumbing dust collection with 5", you are most likely plumbing a Chinese 2HP dust collector, so odds are better than good you are going to be price sensitive. $40.00 fittings are just unacceptable.when you need 10 of them to plumb up a $450.00 after mods dust collector.

Like everything YMMV of course. Everyones tolerance for various cost / performance / availability is diffferent.

For ME, I am going with the hybrid sheet metal / plastic approach. It gives me the ducting size I want, AND keeps my budget in mind.

Something to keep in mind. I fully and readily admin I am a fat guy. I have been losing weight under 'rona which is odd, but I am stil pretty big... WIth the 4" DWV I can fit my hand into the pipe, if I am careful. WIth the 5" I can slide it pretty much all the way up my arm to the elbow. The surface area is huge by comparison.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Mine is tighter than yours. The male end will not fit over the fitting.
I'm dying to know, what brand pipe are you using? I thought they were all more or less standard. Why is yours a snug fit and mine sloppy? Mind you, a difference of 1/16 is all it takes to make for a loose sloppy fit. May not matter when assembling HVAC ducting where everything will be taped up, but I admit I am being OCD. I helped a fellow at my church set up his 6" setup, he's got a Grizzly 3HP I think cyclone... and the pipes were sloppy like mine and we didn't snug up the fittings, and it rattled something bad in use... Took it apart, massaged the male side so it was a bit snugger fit and the rattle went away... Can't do that with plastic.

Anyway, you can clearly see your pipe snugs right up to the shoulder on the male wye.


Mine on the other hand, only stops when it comes up to the branch and has nowhere else to go.


OH, FWIW, you should be able to with some small wood blocks and vise grips, press the crimps out of the male ends enough to make them slide over your fittings. Try to get the male ends pointed toward the DC so air isn't crashing into them... basically plumb it backwards from the way you'd plumb HVAC...
 
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