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Old School
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Any of you guys have experience with West System Resins? I'm going to try out the 105 resin and 206 hardener for bent laminations...

Suggestions, likes / dislikes, gripes, praise, tips...?

Also if you know of a better / cheaper system...

As always, thanks for your input!

~tom
Depending on the lamination, I use either Titebond II or III, or a urea-formaldehyde glue.








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Old School
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24,027 Posts
I've used tb2 for a couple and polys too but just don't trust 'em for long term stability on bent lams... I've heard of using the formaldehyde glues but never have.

Are there any trade offs between the formaldehyde and resins?

~tom
I can't say as I haven't used them. I will say I've had very good results with both the glues I've used. No spring back and a good glue joint. As in any glued joint, the parts must fit well, and be clamped. I do allow "overnight" drying. That may make a difference in being untouched or moved too soon.

One of my heaviest was a 22' foot bridge over a swan pond in a hotel lobby. The lams for the stringers were 3/4"x6" using urea-formaldehyde glue. They were like steel when done...no movement at all.








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In History is the Future
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6,423 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
cabinetman said:
I can't say as I haven't used them. I will say I've had very good results with both the glues I've used. No spring back and a good glue joint. As in any glued joint, the parts must fit well, and be clamped. I do allow "overnight" drying. That may make a difference in being untouched or moved too soon.

One of my heaviest was a 22' foot bridge over a swan pond in a hotel lobby. The lams for the stringers were 3/4"x6" using urea-formaldehyde glue. They were like steel when done...no movement at all.




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Damn, I like that bridge! How did you bend the lam? Come along / winch?

The resin isn't terribly expensive, think I'll try it along side the formaldehyde and see which one works for me, application wise and end result.

Thx

~tom
 

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Old School
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Damn, I like that bridge! How did you bend the lam? Come along / winch?
~tom
I made a form consisting of an MDF curve with the arc struck for the whole length (looked like a long narrow orange slice). The top of the arc was glued up with a 6" x 3/4" "piece used as a form to clamp to. The lams varied in lengths to get overlap. The span (arc) wasn't that radical, and the Red Oak in 3/4" curved fairly easy. The second piece was glued/clamped/screwed to the first. All successive pieces were done the same way.









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In The Basement
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460 Posts
I've used 105/206 for waterproof coatings and found using it to glue soft woods together is difficult. Seems like the resin could soak into the wood forever. I've never gotten a tight bond...regular wood glue works best.
 

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In The Basement
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460 Posts
These birch and poplar boxes have a few layers of epoxy. The first layer will soak into the wood closing the pores and the second coat starts waterproofing. I have pulled some boxes apart (by hand) as a result of the weak bond.





 

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SS user
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2,690 Posts
Never done any lamination but I've used West System's resins and hardeners a lot.
Here is a link to their use guidelines for laminations (about 3 paragraphs down) Guide
You'll note that they recommend the two step process. That can get expensive, depending on the sq. ft. to be coated.
 

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In The Basement
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460 Posts
did you use it like glue to bond pieces together? Or just coat the whole piece?

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...
First, I coat the inside with the wood and top boarder taped together. After the resin hardens I coat the outside and inside. I'm sure you can achieve strength if you use the resin to glue pieces together. Just make sure you use enough resin so when it soaks into the wood there is still some to create a good bond.

What would you like to use the resin for?
 

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In History is the Future
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Discussion Starter #14
aaronhl said:
First, I coat the inside with the wood and top boarder taped together. After the resin hardens I coat the outside and inside. I'm sure you can achieve strength if you use the resin to glue pieces together. Just make sure you use enough resin so when it soaks into the wood there is still some to create a good bond.

What would you like to use the resin for?
Bent laminations. I spoke with a west tech guy before I posted. Apparently this product is very successfully used for this purpose... Only way I'll know is to test it, I guess!

Thx for the info,

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...
 

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Super Moderator
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4,366 Posts
I've used WS epoxies a lot. Very strong joints are possible as the glue is structural and waterproof. The epoxy takes at least 12 hours to cure. You need to be careful about mixing up large batches as it will overheat and crystallize in minutes. Keep the glue spread out in to a thinner layer or keep it in a double bowl, the first with ice to keep the second one (holding the epoxy) cool. You need to coat both surfaces. If it soaks in keep applying until it can produce a coating on the surface. After the epoxy has cured if you plan on painting it you must wash the wax off that forms on the surface.
 

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Old Methane Gas Cloud
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3,500 Posts
There are Titebond glues that are called "extensible" (I think that is the right word.) and are intended for laminations. They come in both I and II variations. I have seen them in my local Woodcraft, they have a more white background label and are about a buck more than the regular in the quart size.
 

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Furniture refinisher
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20 Posts
West Epoxy

In the responses, most seem to offer options & not talk about epoxy. I have used West epoxy for several years in maintaining wooden boats. If used with their pumps it is very easy to maintain the right mix (I use the 3:1 ratio product) And the additives for filllers provide a great set of options for all applications. Get a copy of their book, read it, and have fun! By the way, over the years I have both visited their facility in Bay City MI and called them for advice on usage of the epoxy and always gotten good advise. A problem? Cure time- most folks who I know that don'y like it want instant results & that just ain't possible!
An "old timers" comment!
skipper
 

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In History is the Future
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6,423 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Gayle Roudabush said:
In the responses, most seem to offer options & not talk about epoxy. I have used West epoxy for several years in maintaining wooden boats. If used with their pumps it is very easy to maintain the right mix (I use the 3:1 ratio product) And the additives for filllers provide a great set of options for all applications. Get a copy of their book, read it, and have fun! By the way, over the years I have both visited their facility in Bay City MI and called them for advice on usage of the epoxy and always gotten good advise. A problem? Cure time- most folks who I know that don'y like it want instant results & that just ain't possible!
An "old timers" comment!
skipper
Thanks, someone who uses it! :) lol

I spoke with a tech guy, picked his brain for 30 min. I'll eventually get over to west marine and pick some up to play with, just been crazy busy lately...

~tom ...it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt...
 

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SS user
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Thanks, someone who uses it! :) lol

I spoke with a tech guy, picked his brain for 30 min. I'll eventually get over to west marine and pick some up to play with, just been crazy busy lately...

Tom,
Please let us know how your project with the epoxy comes out.
thanks.
 
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