[cstowers]

Hello All,

I thought I would take the opportunity to practice some joinery that I haven't tried before while building this band saw table.
Okay, I confess, I've only ever jointed using nails and screws :crying2:

I'd like to use a method of joinery that holds up to the expansion and contraction of the wood over time (I know, if done right, nail/screws could do this but I would like to try something else). I was thinking using mortise and tenons to join the red and blue but then what would be a good way to join the yellow to the blue? Also, I thought of using dowels for the table top but I'm not sure of the best way to join the green to the red/blue afterwards?

Also, using a mortise and tenon for the joint that's on an angle seems like it would be a huge pain??

 

[Rodrat]

I don't see why yellow and blue could not also be a mortise and tenon? Maybe put it above or below the other joint if you are worried about there not being enough room.

For the others I got nothing. I'm still learning all this stuff as well.

 

[Steve Neul]

Make the tenons on the red parts long enough you could dowel the yellow parts where the dowels go through the tenons. This would help strengthen the red/blue joint.

If the green pieces are to be glued together as a solid sheet, this is where you will run into trouble with wood movement. To solve this problem you might run some narrow dado's in the top parts yellow and red and use table top fasteners to mount the top. http://www.rockler.com/table-top-fa...e_uqD5gSnnAke5DTvFgQPAXiyyPNXfxgnPhoCBLnw_wcB If the top were plywood which would be better for this application then wood movement wouldn't be an issue.

 

[cstowers]

I don't see why yellow and blue could not also be a mortise and tenon? Maybe put it above or below the other joint if you are worried about there not being enough room.

For the others I got nothing. I'm still learning all this stuff as well.

I forgot to mention I was thinking about putting a shelf on the bottom for the bandsaw motor to sit on. Thanks for the input though, always welcome!

 

[cstowers]

Make the tenons on the red parts long enough you could dowel the yellow parts where the dowels go through the tenons. This would help strengthen the red/blue joint.

If the green pieces are to be glued together as a solid sheet, this is where you will run into trouble with wood movement. To solve this problem you might run some narrow dado's in the top parts yellow and red and use table top fasteners to mount the top. http://www.rockler.com/table-top-fa...e_uqD5gSnnAke5DTvFgQPAXiyyPNXfxgnPhoCBLnw_wcB If the top were plywood which would be better for this application then wood movement wouldn't be an issue.

Thanks Steve!

I like the idea of using the dowels after I mortise and tenon the other joint. And the table top clips are great to (thanks for link!)

 

[Toolman50]

I totally understand your interest in using the saw stand as a learning project for M&T joints, but the increased time you put into the stand could be used on another project.
A well built stand with 3 1/4" screws will be strong and last your lifetime.
If you insist on the M&T's, it will take 10 times longer. Just saying....

 

[cstowers]

I totally understand your interest in using the saw stand as a learning project for M&T joints, but the increased time you put into the stand could be used on another project.

A well built stand with 3 1/4" screws will be strong and last your lifetime.

If you insist on the M&T's, it will take 10 times longer. Just saying....

You make a compelling point. Hmmmm


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[epicfail48]

I totally understand your interest in using the saw stand as a learning project for M&T joints, but the increased time you put into the stand could be used on another project.
A well built stand with 3 1/4" screws will be strong and last your lifetime.
If you insist on the M&T's, it will take 10 times longer. Just saying....

He makes a very compelling point, and in fact it was the same point i was going to make. A tenon on an angled piece in enough of a pain to make, to say nothing of how much of a nightmare the angled mortise would be to cut. It's shop furniture, there's no reason it needs to look pretty. Slap some screws in and call it a day, then get to building the furniture!

 

[woodnthings]

keep it simple ....

Just lap the braces on top of the legs, cut at the same angles and use some screws to join them. Everything will look the same as your sketch, well almost, and will be just as strong. :smile3:

 

[TomCT2]

....You make a compelling point. Hmmmm

but, you set out to drain the swamp - not measure how deep it is.
absolutely zilch wrong with futzing around to learn the do's and do not's of a method, technique, tool.
works for women as well....

go'fer'it.

my only comment would be the casters. I use them widely. mounting on an angle will be tricky - do prototype the design . . .

oh, don't follow their directions about how high to mount them. I've found sticking a 1/2 inch board under the feet then measuring up from on-the-flat lever position works splendidly.

 

[Brian(J)]

You say you want to try something different. Now it seems you might not want to go to all the time and trouble. On the other hand, you will be looking at that saw and stand for a long time, and you might like a little extra pride of ownership. If that's still the case, you might try this approach-
A "corner bridle joint", with one additional simplification: Loose Tenons.
Check out the corner bridle joint on this site:
http://www.raygirling.com/wwjoints.htm

Now imagine that joint, but with the grooves on both sides, and the tongues or tenons made from some other material. To make the grooves, best would be a table saw, but if you are any good with that bandsaw you could cut all the grooves with that, say 3/4" opening, then cut up some 3/4" ply or some 1" x 4"s to get the tongues. Then glue the tongues into both grooves. One thing you will discover is that a mechanical joint like this is so much stronger than screws that even if it's not very good it can still work great.
If the joints turn out tight use regular wood glue, if kinda loose mix up some epoxy to fill the gap and glue at the same time.
I think something like this would be a better step than trying to go all the way from nails to M&T joints, this is sort of a step along the way.
Whatever you do, best of luck.

 

[MEP1]

Most of the comments say the same thing I would, mortise and tenons will be a lot of work with the angles, and very difficult to get right. Assuming you're a beginner from your first comments, I'd do a half-lap joint with glue and screws. That's something you could do with a circular saw.

 

[cstowers]

A "corner bridle joint", with one additional simplification: Loose Tenons.

Check out the corner bridle joint on this site:

http://www.raygirling.com/wwjoints.htm



Now imagine that joint, but with the grooves on both sides, and the tongues or tenons made from some other material. To make the grooves, best would be a table saw, but if you are any good with that bandsaw you could cut all the grooves with that, say 3/4" opening, then cut up some 3/4" ply or some 1" x 4"s to get the tongues. Then glue the tongues into both grooves.

Whatever you do, best of luck.

Thank you Brian for your detailed response. From your explanation above, and from the link. It seems like it would be something of a spline joint (just to make sure I'm understanding you correctly)? Also, for the 3rd joint, would I just use dowels to join to the bridle joint?

Hopefully I'm not too far off here lol. Thanks again for your response.

-Colbi



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[cstowers]

Thank you all for the great advise you've given me regarding the stand I'm building. As soon as I get it together I'll post some pictures showing what I decided to do (or at least what I ended up with lol).

-Colbi


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[Brian(J)]

Thank you Brian for your detailed response. From your explanation above, and from the link. It seems like it would be something of a spline joint (just to make sure I'm understanding you correctly)? Also, for the 3rd joint, would I just use dowels to join to the bridle joint?

Hopefully I'm not too far off here lol. Thanks again for your response.

-Colbi

Colbi, I see I didn't provide you with a complete design. I'll try to sketch something up and I'll post it to the thread.

 

[TimPa]

I forgot to mention I was thinking about putting a shelf on the bottom for the bandsaw motor to sit on. Thanks for the input though, always welcome!

I would close the cabinet in then. if not, the motor and shelf will continuously be covered in much sawdust.

 

[FrankC]

I say go for it, you will have give or take $20 invested, better to practice on that than $200 worth of hardwood for a piece of furniture.

 

[jeremymcon]

Why do the legs need to be angled? If it's your front attempt at mortise and tenons, it'd be way easier to make the stand with all square joints. Just make it wider of you're worried about it tipping over. As long as it's not so wide that you're bumping our knees when you are sawing, what's the difference? Then your casters will be easier to mount also.

 

[cstowers]

Here's the finished product. I ended up just going with basic joints. I had some trouble getting the old saw working so I was just ready for it to be useable.


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[Pineknot_86]

I have built tables for the shop and didn't take time to make M&T joints. I just put the boards on top of the legs and used drywall screws to put it together.