[memory12]

I am working on a little project and I am in the process of staining the boards. The boards are 2x6 oak boards and this is a backstop for a farm wagon. It is nothing fancy, just two vertical boards and four horizontal boards spaced evenly apart.

I got the backstop built and just finished staining both sides, just waiting for it to dry now. My question is where the horizontal boards meet the vertical boards or where any two boards meet, should that be stained in between there? In my experience, that is the first place to start rotting.

Since I already have the backstop together, it would be kind of a pain to take the boards back off. The bolts are fairly tight. The holes in the vertical boards are drilled in the skinny side of the board. I just wonder if it would be worth the time.

The wagon is stored inside for the most part but there are times when it does sit out in the weather. The stain is Duckback Superdeck semi transparent stain.

Sorry if this is in the wrong section, feel free to move it if it is.

 

[Steve Neul]

As far as where to stain, I would stain it everywhere. The Duckback stain is a sealant. If you used red oak you better keep it out of the weather as much as possible and perhaps put a spar varnish over it. Red oak turns black when it gets wet. On the other hand if you used white oak you will probably be alright.

 

[HowardAcheson]

What species of wood are you using? Some are much more susceptible to rot than others.

You mention "stain" that you are applying. What "stain" are you using? Most stains are not a protective coating and are not effective outdoors unless you are using one formulated for exterior use.

 

[cabinetman]

We have an introduction section where you can say a few words about yourself. If you fill out your profile in your "User Control Panel", you can list any hobbies or other facts. You can also list your general geographical location which would be a help in answering some questions.

It would help if all surfaces are finished. But, at the stage you are in, may not matter. If you'll lose sleep, go ahead and take it apart and apply the finish.

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[cabinetman]

What species of wood are you using? Some are much more susceptible to rot than others.

You mention "stain" that you are applying. What "stain" are you using? Most stains are not a protective coating and are not effective outdoors unless you are using one formulated for exterior use.

In his post he mentioned "Oak". Did not say white or red. He also mentioned the stain as...Duckback Superdeck semi transparent stain.

.

 

[memory12]

As far as where to stain, I would stain it everywhere. The Duckback stain is a sealant. If you used red oak you better keep it out of the weather as much as possible and perhaps put a spar varnish over it. Red oak turns black when it gets wet. On the other hand if you used white oak you will probably be alright.

You say red oak will turn black when wet, will it return to the original color once it dries? Should I stain the bottom of the boards? I figure leave the bottom open so if moisture does penetrate the stain, it can still dry out.

I am not sure what type of oak it is. These are just rough cut pieces. Is there a way to tell? I can post pics if needed.

Thanks for the comments.

 

[Steve Neul]

You say red oak will turn black when wet, will it return to the original color once it dries? Should I stain the bottom of the boards? I figure leave the bottom open so if moisture does penetrate the stain, it can still dry out.

I am not sure what type of oak it is. These are just rough cut pieces. Is there a way to tell? I can post pics if needed.

Thanks for the comments.

No it won't go back to the original color. It will get blacker every time it get's wet. If it is red oak you need to do an overkill in sealing it and the deck stain isn't that at all. If you seal the top and not the underside the water will wick up under the finish rottening the wood. All surfaces should be sealed.

You might post a picture to tell which kind of oak it is but sometimes it's difficult to tell the difference when there in person. There is some white oak that looks like red oak and vise versa. Red oak is usually a little pink in color when in raw wood where white oak is more blonde or light brown.

 

[Gilgaron]

Apart from color, the end grain will be porous with red oak and smooth with white oak.

 

[memory12]

No it won't go back to the original color. It will get blacker every time it get's wet. If it is red oak you need to do an overkill in sealing it and the deck stain isn't that at all. If you seal the top and not the underside the water will wick up under the finish rottening the wood. All surfaces should be sealed.

You might post a picture to tell which kind of oak it is but sometimes it's difficult to tell the difference when there in person. There is some white oak that looks like red oak and vise versa. Red oak is usually a little pink in color when in raw wood where white oak is more blonde or light brown.

I don't like to hear that it turns black when it is wet. Now I an starting to regret staining it. Oh well, kind of late now. I don't have time to start all over.

If in fact it is red oak, what kind of product should I have used? I bought the stain at a local store.

If the bottom is left unstained, will that cause it to rot quicker than if I stained it? I was under the impression that you would leave the bottom side unstained so if any water did get inside the wood, it would not trap that water. Or does that have to do with painting wood.

Another question, for exterior wood, which would be better, paint it or stain it?

Going by your description, I would say I have white oak. I might try to post a pic tonight if I get time.

Another issue I am having is it is taking a real long time to dry. I got done staining it probably 3 days ago and it is still not dry. I stained it inside a enclosed building where the temp stays between 50 and 60 degrees. According to the gallon can, any where above 40 degrees is fine.

For the most part, this wagon is put inside but does get left out a time or two but we always try to keep it inside.

 

[Noek]

Hi,

I just got done staining a project on red oak. I used a water based dye, which dried very fast, 10 minutes or so. I then used 3 coats Zinnser seal coat/light sanding and I will add layers of water based urethane finish. Did have problems with grain raising due to the water but I figured out a few ways to deal with it.

This is for indoors so not sure how this type of finish would hold up outdoors.

 

[Al B Thayer]

Hi,

I just got done staining a project on red oak. I used a water based dye, which dried very fast, 10 minutes or so. I then used 3 coats Zinnser seal coat/light sanding and I will add layers of water based urethane finish. Did have problems with grain raising due to the water but I figured out a few ways to deal with it.

This is for indoors so not sure how this type of finish would hold up outdoors.

I like to wipe down the wood with a wet rag, let it dry and sand for the last time. Then finish. Far less raised grain and little fuzzies.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.

 

[memory12]

How well will this stain work on treated pine? Will it turn colors if it gets wet?

Any ideas why this stain is taking so long to dry?

 

[Steve Neul]

How well will this stain work on treated pine? Will it turn colors if it gets wet?

Any ideas why this stain is taking so long to dry?

You would be alright with pressure treated pine. It would just turn gray and crack a little if you didn't put a finish on it at all. Anyway since you have the oak made I would go with that until it gives you trouble. The stain you used while may not protect it much won't hurt it. If you are patient and let it dry completely you can coat over the stain with a spar varnish which would seal out the water better.

I think the reason the stain isn't drying for you is the deck stain is really formulated for more porous wood like western cedar and it can't get into the oak. It's possible you just put too much on too. If it were me I would wipe off the excess with a little lacquer thinner and it will dry.

 

[memory12]

I think I decided not to stain the pine because the pine will not be on the wagon all the time, just in the fall time when we do hayrides and is kept inside when not in use during that time.

What type of product should I have used? I am kind of worried about looks since this will be used for hayrides but I will sacrifice looks for better protection.

I took a couple of pics to possibly identify the type of wood I am using.





This is what the backstop looks like.


If I was going to do this right, what should have been done? I mean, I did not use any type of cleaner on it, I did not sand it or anything. I just don't have the time to do all that stuff.

Thanks for all the help so far.

 

[Steve Neul]

The wood does have a white oak look to it. As an afterthought you might take some of the scraps left off the project and put it in water. If there is a problem you should be able to see something in a couple of days if it turns out to be red oak. The color isn't enough to really tell as some red oak is very white in color.

If the wood really is white oak it is an acceptable wood for exterior use. There are some places where there are architecture codes in building construction where doors and windows cannot have a finish put on them. White oak is used because it holds up good in the weather and the wood is just allowed to turn gray.

You could have also used the treated wood. I put a new deck on a utility trailer in August of 2009 and didn't put any finish on it at all. It has a few oil stains from a tractor but the rest of it is barely gray. A deck stain would have been good for the appearance but the treated wood holds up very good without it.

 

[cabinetman]

Looking at the four horizontal pieces, they look like Pine (SPF) to me.

.

 

[Noek]

I like to wipe down the wood with a wet rag, let it dry and sand for the last time. Then finish. Far less raised grain and little fuzzies.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.

Al,

I did this to one panel but I think I waited a day or two to apply the stain and the grain popped just as bad as when I wetted it down.

For the remainder of the project, I stained immediately after wetting down/sanding and the grain seemed a little more stable. I'm not sure why the time difference mattered but it sure made a difference. Thanks!

 

[Al B Thayer]

Al,

I did this to one panel but I think I waited a day or two to apply the stain and the grain popped just as bad as when I wetted it down.

For the remainder of the project, I stained immediately after wetting down/sanding and the grain seemed a little more stable. I'm not sure why the time difference mattered but it sure made a difference. Thanks!

What are you using for stain? Is it water base.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.

 

[Noek]

Al

Yes it's a General Finished water based dye

 

[Al B Thayer]

Al

Yes it's a General Finished water based dye

It shouldn't raise much after the first time wetting and sanding. I have never had it raise after wetting and sanding twice. I like the idea of using dye but the water base just messes with nature too much.

Pound it out and drop us some pictures.

Al

Nails only hold themselves.