Woodworking Talk banner
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
250 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm mocking up a new workshop plan and have designed a 10' x 22' building with 8' ceilings. I might go 9 or possibly 10 but that largely depends on roof design and clearance from some rather large trees. It's kinda hidden out in the woods a little bit behind my house but still close enough that I plan to run a 40 or 60amp service to it, which is sufficient to power at least 2 high powered tools simultaneously. (or one tool with an electric heater in the winter) I know 10' isn't very wide but I'm working within the clearing space I have.

Anyone who's built their own shop before, anything you wish you had done differently? Type of flooring? Location of outlets? Any weird things you didn't consider until you started to use the space.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,609 Posts
I have a 10x16 shop in the basement, so another six feet sounds luxurious!

Where do you live? Climate makes a difference.

I have wood floors, and they're super comfortable. The only issue is that they dent when you drop tools.

In a detached shop, I would go with a raised plywood floor. The air space between the ground and the floor makes a difference for comfort.

Put some outlets up high around 48" or so. That will make it easier to plug in tools. Your shop carts, benches, etc will cover up the ones that are standard 12" from the floor.

Consider painting the walls white, I love that in my shop.

Add double doors rather than a single.

Put in a sink if at all possible. That will help with finishing if you use WB products.

Have fun building the new shop!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
250 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I'm in Ohio, where winter ranges from 30 degrees to 0. And summers typically 80-90s. Sometimes both in the same day.

For the floor I've priced at 3/4" plywood (not osb). Whether or not I put something over that I haven't decided. The foundation I haven't quite planned out yet. It'll either be raised on some deck blocks, or I'll do proper cinderblock around the whole perimeter. The reason for the later is to keep any critters from living under it, I have a lot of gophers and mice. I thought having the air flow under the floor would make it colder?

Double doors is the plan. I made something in my basement once and it was a real pain getting out the single door at the top of the steps! At the moment I have a 6' one priced out, but I plan on checking out the local habitat stores for a bargain because double doors are pricey! Still haven't decided on the best place for the door, wondering if I should put it on one of the 10' walls or in the middle of the 24'.

I might be able to run water out there, but I don't know about a drain pipe. At least not one that would flow uphill back to a sewer line.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
911 Posts
I'll do proper cinderblock around the whole perimeter. The reason for the later is to keep any critters from living under it, I have a lot of gophers and mice. I thought having the air flow under the floor would make it colder?
In a detached shop, I would go with a raised plywood floor. The air space between the ground and the floor makes a difference for comfort.
I believe Sanchez is referring to a floor raised above the ground, sitting on a closed foundation, creating a "trapped" air space.
If you create a trapped airspace, this insulates the floor from heat transfer. It would be best to lay down a moisture barrier on the ground surface inside the foundation, to prevent moisture rising to the plywood floor.

If you prefer a vented airspace, (to help control moisture), a layer of hard foam building insulation board sandwiched under the floor, would be helpful in insulating and keeping the floor warm.

The foam board insulation can of course be used with either type of foundation space (trapped air or vented).
 

·
Wishing he had a title...
Joined
·
525 Posts
Just built my second one and have a third on the drawing board. A lot depends on what you want to do there. But....

1. As large as possible.
2. Tall ceilings make it easier to handle sheet good and lumber
3 At least 60 amp service. The cost to to run larger service is minimal.
4. Lots of outlets.
5. Heating is important. I am in a temporary shop right now and struggling with that issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
284 Posts
There truly is an art to working in a small space efficiently. The consensus is to double whatever size your thinking. You'll always want more space. I know that's just not always an option. I started in a 10x12 shed. It teaches you a lot if you actually use it for projects/work. Dragging your tools out in the yard in the rain and cold isn't for everybody. You'll have to focus on using every last square inch and hidden corner in there to work effectively. Attic space, stud spaces etc..
 

·
where's my table saw?
Joined
·
29,921 Posts
I'm mocking up a new workshop plan and have designed a 10' x 22' building with 8' ceilings. I might go 9 or possibly 10 but that largely depends on roof design and clearance from some rather large trees. It's kinda hidden out in the woods a little bit behind my house but still close enough that I plan to run a 40 or 60amp service to it, which is sufficient to power at least 2 high powered tools simultaneously. (or one tool with an electric heater in the winter) I know 10' isn't very wide but I'm working within the clearing space I have.

Anyone who's built their own shop before, anything you wish you had done differently? Type of flooring? Location of outlets? Any weird things you didn't consider until you started to use the space.
If you can, you will never regret 10 ft ceilings! A 60 AMP service is the minimum. You can have additional receptacles that total more than 60 AMPs you just can't draw more current than 60. I have a 100 AMP panel and every slot is filled... 8 - 220 volt and 12 - 120 volt. I heat with electric a 19,000 BTU 220 volt space heater, lower peninsula Michigan. I keep the shop at 50 F and turn it up when I'm out there working. I have a double door 6ft wide, with an overhead beam and chain fall for lifting heavy machines.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,406 Posts
8' is definitely too low. 10' would be good. In addition to being able to stand 2x's and plywood, you could also suspend shelving overhead. I am renting a 10x30 mini storage bay and it is just a tad to small. If you have the luxury of going bigger, go longer, not wider.
Unless you plan on a garage type door, I would definitely have 2 doors opening outward from wall to wall. If not practical, have the total open space at least 6' wide floor to ceiling.
Don't know if you have the luxury option of which way to run the building front to rear, but if you do, consider the direction of the sun traveling over the roof.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,609 Posts
I believe Sanchez is referring to a floor raised above the ground, sitting on a closed foundation, creating a "trapped" air space.
If you create a trapped airspace, this insulates the floor from heat transfer.
Yup, that's exactly what I meant, Dave. Thanks for adding more construction considerations.

My basement floor is Platon on the concrete (which is a combination vapor barrier/air space product), OSB, 3/4" pre-finished wood. The floors are much warmer than basements with floors directly on the concrete.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,406 Posts
I would without a doubt, put the doors on the 10'wall.
Put your table saw about 5' back from the door and an outfeed table on wheels behind the table saw. This way you can unload from truck onto table saw and cut right away or just slide it across to the outfeed table and still have room to walk/work around it.
Also plan all your work tables/assembly tables, and other 'stationary' machines on retractable wheels. This gets expensive but worth the money. Cheap casters with brakes dont normally work well with heavy tables or heavy loads. The only casters I have put on my machines are on my lathe and the set of 4 was $50. I good set of casters is expensive. Also all my work tables including router table, assembly table and work bench are 1/8' to 1/4" lower than my table saw with wheels retracted. Lathe excluded. This allows me to slide full pieces of plywood just about anywhere with ease.
All of the above is predicated on the casual use of plywood from time to time. If you will never use plywood, forget the above recommendations.
 

·
Registered
Termite
Joined
·
5,813 Posts
I'd have my compressor and dust collection in a separate room or an extension of the shop. I hate hearing either one on..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
I agree with all above with this possible add on.
2x6 stud walls, insulated except fir an area (4×8-8×8) with only a thin foam against the outer wall then shelves inserted between the studs, then build the doors out of 2x4 or 2x6 on edge outer skin with OSB or ply to hang tools on or more shelves, only loosing 6"x whatever width you choose x 8' high.
Out of sight out of mind for drip in visitors.
Walls as high as possible, mine are10' wirh no regrets, cathedral ceiling, the open volume is a great feeling and 8' LED's & a switched ceiling fan...just in case.
Wheel Car Tire Light Vehicle


Sent from my SM-A515U using Tapatalk
 

·
Thumb Nailer
Joined
·
2,482 Posts
TL: DR. Concentrate on going small, and organizing as efficiently as possible. Insulate, and use radiant barrier for thermal efficiency.


You apparently aren't quite as restricted as I am, but close.

I am doing something similar in coastal TX, so my climate issues are different from you in Ohio.

I am limited to 200 sq /ft, so 10x20, and max peak roof height of 9' so IF I get lucky I can pull off 8' ceilings. Having said that.

#1. Absolutely insulate the building, and use radiant barrier. A shed in 90 degree weather can be a real hot box.
#2. Do a full perimeter cinder block foundation / enclose the foundation to deny pests access to the underside of the foundation.
#3. Yes, use foam board insulation under the floor. Your thermal comfort will be improved, and if you have neighbors, your noise transmission will be reduced.
#4. Like you said, double doors. And yes double doors new are stupid expensive. Habitat for Humanity Re-Store very often has double doors for next to nothing. I would however NOT use doors with large amounts of glass for security reasons. You can also, since this is basically a shed, just build your own shed doors. Up to you. My plan is double shed doors with hanging storage on one of them.
#5. In that small space, your selection of tools and configuration of storage is going to be challenging. some takeaways from my experience in that matter.
-A. Ignore the naysayers and haters, benchtop tools can be VERY beneficial in a tiny shop. Most notably, this is NOT where you will want a giant floor model jointer, planer etc... But rather the best benchtop models you can equip with. If I had the $$ and had to do it over again, I would go with a DW735x and a Wahuda 10".
-B for those bench top tools, design and configure a "Tool Stacker" system, basically determine a common size board to mount your tools on, grab some heavy duty shelf standards and arms, mount the tools up one at a time obviously, and stack them vertically. Placing the lightest tools down lowest so as to minimize lifting heavy items from down low. Oh, that ligtest items down low is a theme, keep it in mind. My tool stacker from bottom to top has a Rigid oscillating spindle / belt sander, Ryobi 13" planer, Sunhill benchtop 6" jointer, Ryobi 8" grinder set up for sharpening, and Dremel 16" scroll saw. That is an awful lot of function / tools stored in a 24" x 18" space, not counting the tables for the jointer of course, they protrude...
-C. Resist the urge to go with a huge separte dust barrel, or outside venting for your dust collection system. How many cubic feet of air is in a 10x22x8 interior volume? (1760), so assuming you have a 1500cfm dust collector (yeah right, like they actually move THAT much air, but I digress). Heck, just assume you are moving 900cfm, do you really want to suck up and blow outdoors your entire heated or cooled interior volume of air in less than 2 minutes? I don't. And I have found that the 55 gallon drum separator next to the dust collector is just a space sucker. Do a 2 stage conversion if you want to go all fancy, or just make and install a Thien baffle in the separator ring of your single stage collector and deal with changing bags out now and again... You'll buy yourself back at least 4 sq ft which isn't a lot, but in a 200 sq ft space, 4 here, 4 there and...
-D. IF you can afford it, and want to have a sliding miter saw, get one with a front slide that does not take up any more room than a standard non slider. My 12" rear slide SCMS is a space hog. Other than the space the slide uses, I love the saw, but despise how much of a footprint it has.
-E Resign yourself to the fact that there are some things you will have to do outside, like breaking down sheet goods into more manageable sizes.
-F. Large floor standing tools, if possible, design and build cabinets to replace the stands. And design them with stroage drawers, open cabinets etc... The whole point here is to establish storage in what would otherwise be wasted space.
-G Allow for at least 60 amp service. If you, or your electrician is worth your salt in this, have 220v and 110v available. In my experience In my shop I use... 1 20 amp circuit for the dust collector, OR the air compressor. I never run both at the same time so no need to have them sepaarate. This circuit also provides power my my Grizzly ambient air cleaner. 1 20 amp circuit to run one main power tool. And 1 20 amp circuit to run HVAC, In this tiny of a space, I use a 5K BTU window unit AC for cooling, and a little 1000w ceramic space heater with a thermostat and fan. This circuit is where the lighting will be run off of as well. I HIGHLY recommend going with LED shop lights if you can find good ones for not too much money as they will use a lot less power.
-H. I forgot to mention it above, but I would do double layer flooring of 3/4" plywood, and stagger them crosswise. The weight of the tools, supplies, projects, and human will add up over time. Make your floor strong. And since you are in a snow zone, it wouldn't hurt to epoxy coat it if you can manage.
-I. If you have an air system, pipe it through the shop, with outlets every 4 to 6 feet. Use good quality hoses, and keep them as short as is feaseable. Failing that, use an overhead hose reel. The idea is to keep the hoses from cluttering up the floor, benches etc... I have kind of a stupid large air hose collection and wish I could cut it back a bit. Honestly a few of them were the old let;s try this kind of hose to see if I like it. Nope, hate it...
-J. I mentioned keeping the dust collector inside, however, an air compressor, at least where I am, as long as it is weather protected by like a little roof and fenced in a bit, is just fine outdoors. My BILs body shop has 2 giant compressors under a basic lean to, been that way for 30 years.
-K. Don't go all pegboard on the walls. Build multi layer pegboard cabinets. I have a pair I built from some old Wood Magazine plans, and they are great. LOTS of storage in a MUCH smaller area, and well organized.
-L Resist the urge to collect all manner of finishes and shop chemicals. I have way too large a collection of spray paint that is now killing me on storage, and maybe 4 cans of WD-40 as well?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
250 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I priced out my options for doing 2x4 vs 2x6 and 8' vs 9'-10'. I read another thread where pretty much every said 8' was a minimum but everyone wanted taller because of 4x8 materials. If I can go over 8' I will, I'll have to check some things outside first. Also I might put on a gambrel roof which give me a few feet of extra headroom. Because of leaves piling up and snow, the floor will already be raised off the ground by at least a foot and I have to consider the overall height of the building.

2x4x8 - $272
2x4x10- $390
2x6x8 - $415
2x6x10 - $540

I'm at about $700 for the floor already (darn plywood prices). I'm trying to keep this project under $2k, which may sound ludicrous for a shop build. All the electric I need I already own so that'll help. If I go with 2x6 that's 50% more for the walls and I haven't priced my roof yet. But having done renovations before, I already know that if I want something it will 100% of the time win over budgeting.

Isolated room for a compressor/vacuum sounds like a good idea. My compressor is super quiet however, rated at only 60db (a loud dishwasher). My shotvac though sounds like a jet, probably because it has more hp than a lawnmower.

At the moment, there's no way to get a truck to the spot, but I can get within 50' probably. The area currently has old animal stalls from however many decades ago. I do not have nor plan to have any goats so I'm ripping it out to put in the shop. I can probably salvage some of the heavy gauge steel roofing, but other parts were crushed under a tree.

What's everyone's opinions on having windows in the shop? I love having the natural light but wondering if it'll kill my wall space and just get in the way.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,406 Posts
I forgot the electrical - all my outlets are around chest high. No excuse for not easily being able to un-plug. Because of the construction of mini-storage bays, the verticals are 10' apart and so all of my 4way elec outlets are 10' apart on both long walls. Generally, no need for extension cords.
The other thing is that my shop obviously has no windows in a mini-storage complex. And..........I dont miss them. Being a small shop, you can't afford the wall space. Every square inch is valuable.
My bay is 30' long and I have 8 Harbor Freight 4' LED lights. You need sun glasses if all are on at the same time. I have them in 3 separate outlets with switches. The first and second sections have 3 LED's each and the last section has 2 of the 4' LED's. Rarely ever need the last set of lights. because my rear wall is pretty much nothing but my vertical wood storage racks.
OH, and one more thing about the height.If for some logistical reasons you cant find overhead space the full length, you could always slope the roof from 8' front to 10' rear or the other way around.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,406 Posts
Here is my take on the matter. I am renting a 10 x 30, the length is fine but wish it was just a tad wider. My restrictions are in cost and if I decide to, I can always simply pay more and move to a larger unit. Your proposed shop is rather small and you will wish you made it bigger. If you have code or other restrictions, that is understandable. But if it is cost, you might want to save and wait a little longer.
If my shop was 12 x 30, that's just 2 feet wider, it would make a tremendous difference. 15 X 30 would be the perfect size for me. I like to make furniture. In making furniture, you have to have human working space and project working space. If you constantly have to move stuff around, that gets old quick, yet some still do that. You are building from the ground up and so you should have more options. Just something to think about. If you are just going to do craft work, your 10x22 should be just fine. If you have physical restrictions like codes or trees, well, so be it. It is what it is.
Just something to think about.
 

·
Thumb Nailer
Joined
·
2,482 Posts
@Tony B mentioned electrical which got me thinking. Put all of your plugs above bench height. You do NOT want to be finshing around under workbenches to get to your outlets. When I had my garage wrokshop wired, all of the outlets were placed at 40"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,045 Posts
I am still "working" on getting my shop the way I want it. There is a long way to go. One aspect of my plans includes adding support for 220 volt woodworking tools. That sounds like a sub panel is in my future, but I haven't gotten that far on how I want to do it.

What I want to share is:

Whatever I do, I will be sure that it can support the requirements to charge an electric vehicle, in case we ever own one. Hopefully that will increase the value of our home, or make it easier to sell our home when the time comes someday.
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Top