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Discussion Starter #1
A thank you to those that have given some advise and help previously. Im still working on the floor and walls and what not, but id like to plan out how im going to frame out and insulate this basement room, so i can make a list of materials and amounts and work out a estimate on cost. ect.



Trouble is after a lot of time of reading articles and watching videos.. im still no further as to how i want to proceed. Mainly because every thing i find is incredibly contradictory. So im looking for some help or insight if anyone knows this field.





^that vid is the basement. Still working on it. The area i want to frame out is fairly easy to see. At the very start, if you look at the top of the screen you can see the wood sticking out from where the door was. (It came down when i was removing the other walls frame.) So right along that line will be the new wall, so the door will stay there. It will go right along the two concrete walls and the fourth one comes out abut where the old paint on the wall ends.


I need to frame it out and insulate it so i can move my pets down there. They are temperature sensitive so i need to be able to control the temp in the new room.


All of that being said... im not sure the smart/correct way to go about this in the basement; particularly against the concrete walls.. Iv read that you should really have a plastic sheet as a vapor barrier between the wall and the frame. But iv also found reports saying that its a horrible idea. The same thing applies to that sheet board insulation that gets glued to the concrete as a barrier. - Iv read/seen reports of it begin done wrong creating mold issues within the stud wall insulation.
Iv considered making the stud walls a couple feet in from the concrete walls. Id rather avoid that if i can. But if i must then i will.


So before i can do anything, i need to figure that bit out. (The basement is in south central PA, if that matters)
 

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https://buildingscience.com/documents/information-sheets/basement-insulation and you will have your answer. Or go to DIYCHAT and ask the guys there , as that is where I got a wealth of info on my basement project.
I have 1" XPS heavily glued to the walls with a stud wall against that with R13 glass. No issues but I control the basement humidity.
Ideally should have been 2" XPS and hollow stud walls for my area but like I said I control the humidity also it is a bone dry basement.
Ceramic tile floor for durability as I have full to partial exposure to none so a fair amount of foot traffic but this hurts me on winter heating.
Regardless 64-66 winter temps barely heated and goes right up to 68/70 when I want.
You want warmer than you need to insulate the floor.
5 furnace runs with floor returns (1800 sq ft) and lots of incandescent canned lights with some on dimmers make you feel warmer than it is.
Don't forget XPS on the band joist and I covered it with roxul (mineral wool for safety) not fiberglass. Don't forget fire blocking on the foam wall .
Oh yeah northern Illinois , it get cold here in the winter.
 

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You don't need a vapor barrier. Plastic attracts condensation. I can't tell you how much mildewed plastic I've removed patching drywall over the years... We've already learned that your basement has a moisture issue. Solid barrier insulation would be a moot point, and expensive. After all, you have no extremes of weather to protect against. Moisture is going to be your big battle. That, and critters.

Build it in such a way that the walls and the floor are off the concrete, so air can circulate, and you should be able to insulate it with whatever you want to. Just keep a significant air gap around it. You'll probably need a fan handy to circulate air around it at intervals, to keep the walls dry. The only reason I would have a gap over 3" would be to get at any bugs that might take advantage of the dark warm space. But that's for you to decide how to deal with.

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The answers to many of the questions that you are asking are highly dependent upon the climate where you live and the moisture in the soil around your house. If you are doing this in Phoenix it is one thing. If in Northern Michigan another and Southern Louisianan another.


George
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
We've already learned that your basement has a moisture issue. Solid barrier insulation would be a moot point, and expensive. After all, you have no extremes of weather to protect against. Moisture is going to be your big battle. That, and critters.

Build it in such a way that the walls and the floor are off the concrete, so air can circulate, and you should be able to insulate it with whatever you want to. Just keep a significant air gap around it. You'll probably need a fan handy to circulate air around it at intervals, to keep the walls dry. The only reason I would have a gap over 3" would be to get at any bugs that might take advantage of the dark warm space. But that's for you to decide how to deal with.
The only saving grace of the water leakage issues, for the moment at least, is thats its on the other side of the basement from where this room is being made.

As for weather extremes, i guess that depends on where you draw the line at. In south central PA, we do get winter weeks in the single digits and summer weeks in the 90ss or 100's. Its fairly common.

Wouldnt a 3" gap off the walls make it a lot more tempting for bugs and critters to hide in?



Fyi's:
I will be getting a dehumidifier for the new room as well as one for the basement outside the room. And the portable ac unit for the room has a dehumidifier as well.

I know the water leakage issue on the other side of the basement needs to be taken care of but its something i simply cant do right now.

Being able to control the temp and humidity of the new room is crucial for my pets that are going in it. Luckily in this case, they need the cold. But 72-75F+ starts putting there lives at risk. So i need the ability to keep it cool at all times. And preferable not take a crap ton of electricity every month.
 

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Well, you'll have to have an air gap somewhere, or else you'll have mildew. Your weather is similar to ours, high humidity with extremes. You can ge mildew on a cardboard box setting against a wall in the house here, simply because of relative humidity. I'm sure PA is no different. So, you need some kind of air gap between the insulation and the block wall. The more the better, but an inch minimum.
But, those darn bugs....


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Discussion Starter #7
Well, you'll have to have an air gap somewhere, or else you'll have mildew. Your weather is similar to ours, high humidity with extremes. You can ge mildew on a cardboard box setting against a wall in the house here, simply because of relative humidity. I'm sure PA is no different. So, you need some kind of air gap between the insulation and the block wall. The more the better, but an inch minimum.
But, those darn bugs....

So a room inside a room is probably the best approach here? Standard 2x4 framing with insulation just a decent bit of distance off the wall for circulation.
What about the floor? I was thinking about leaving it bare concrete. But then i considering a linoleum or something since i had to reseal the concrete. (so no structural floor). But would i have to build a floor off the ground for circulation as well?
 

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Since you are going to have a dehumidifier in there, I'd probably leave it bare. You might consider putting down some foam sill plate seal, just to keep any water from wicking into the sole plates. Then, I would think, you'd be in good shape. Unless the other guys around here have any other suggestions...

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Discussion Starter #9
Since you are going to have a dehumidifier in there, I'd probably leave it bare. You might consider putting down some foam sill plate seal, just to keep any water from wicking into the sole plates. Then, I would think, you'd be in good shape. Unless the other guys around here have any other suggestions...

Something like this you mean? Strangely enough iv never seen this used before. Would it just go right under the sill plate?
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Owens-C...ti-Use-Ridged-Sill-Plate-Gasket-2FS/202080947


Also, just so i know, would adding something like a linolium sheet over the floor (that was not attached with adhesive or glues) pose any potential issues?
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thank you for the information.



I guess that leaves the roof of this new room in the basement. I was thinking about just insulting between the main joists of the house. But i read that you shouldnt insulate between floors. (Which i dont get.) - The room has to be kept cold. But the main floor of the house id rather.. not be cold. So it seems like a barrier of some king would be a good idea.



Is there any risk of doing that? That section of the basement that the room will be in does not have any plumbing pipes up there. (there is a couple inch section near, but that will likely be outside of the room if i put the frame wall a few inches off the cinder block wall)
 

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Discussion Starter #13
In addition to that, i have another question about framing corners. More specifically the up/down sides of these three different methods (in case im missing something.) Dont mind the cheap demonstration pics.




^

Pic 1: Cali corner. Allows a bit of insulation in the back portion. But it sticks out right where i would have the first stud for the wall. Seems a bit less stable to me.





^

Pic 2: 3 stud corner. Seems like it would be fairly stable. Provides a backing for the first studs on both walls. Small ~1/2" space in between that would probably need filled with a spray insulation or something. Or press both together leaving the 1/2" space on the outside.









^

Pic 3. Same thing as pic2 but in a different direction.





I got half way though the first part planning this room out in the basement when i remembered that i should probably figure how i want to corner it...
 

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I have used #1 and a variation of #2 - with 2x spacers between the 2 studs, not 1/2". the spacers can be short junk 2x4's. my preference is #1, easier to align imho.


as it is #2 & #3 don't give you a nailer for the right side drywall??
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
I have used #1 and a variation of #2 - with 2x spacers between the 2 studs, not 1/2". the spacers can be short junk 2x4's. my preference is #1, easier to align imho.


as it is #2 & #3 don't give you a nailer for the right side drywall??
i ran out of short 2x4 chunk to show this with. But the two pieces in the corner are just the backers/support. The one in the front would be the first 2x4 stud of the wall. - What i didnt have a piece to show, was a 2x4 that would go to the right of those backers that would be the first stud of that wall as well.












^so that would be more accurate to what i meant.
 
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