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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi Guys,

This topic has probably been beaten to death through the years but I thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. I got to reading about smaller dust separators and decided to try the Oneida Dust Deputy after seeing a test on a Wood Whisperer video. The price for the DIY version is down to $39 + shipping so I got one for about $50 total from Woodcraft. If you have a Woodcraft store near you I'd guess you could avoid the shipping.

Anyway, the unit came quickly and was packed well. Unlike reports I'd heard about earlier models, this one seem to be solidly constructed. The top was on securely and it seems to be somewhat impact resistant (I didn't beat it with a hammer or anything, but it looks like decent plastic).

Though the approximately 2" OD tapered inlet and outlet ports fit a lot of shop vac hoses, they are too small for 2-1/2" dust collection hose. I solved this with a Fernco PQB-215 rubber pipe bushing from Home Depot. After cutting it's inner lip off with a utility knife, it slipped over the DD's tapered ports. I slid it on until it expanded to just the right diameter to clamp the 2-1/2" hose. Problem solved for $1.80 per bushing.


Bushing with the lip cut partway off.



2-1/2" DC hose installed with the bushing - you can see the other bushing on the inlet.


It's too bad that they don't make a DD that has slightly larger ports. If they were the right size to fit a regular 2-1/2" dust collection hose without a bushing, I'm sure there would be better air flow.

For a container I got two of HD's 'Homer Buckets' and one sealed lid. I figured the advantage to using one bucket inside the other was that it would help prevent the top dust bucket from collapsing if there was too much vacuum, plus the space under the top bucket would be a good place to put sand to act as a weight to help prevent tip-over. Incidentally, the lids seal really well.

I cut a 3" hole in the middle of the bucket lid with a big Forstner bit and used the DD as a pattern for the 6 bolt holes. I made a 3/8" plywood ring of the same pattern for the bottom of the lid to stiffen things up a bit, then bolted it all together using silicone sealer to seal the DD to the lid.

For testing I tried two things. One was putting the DD on a small (7.3A) Ridgid shop vac that I hook up as needed to my belt/disk sander, miter saw and router table. All three tools are adjacent so I just switch the vac's hose around. First I emptied the vac and put a new filter in it. Then I sanded some plywood on the disk and belt, then chopped a 1x6 a bunch of times on the miter saw. There was a small amount of fine sawdust in the DD and nothing noticeable at all in the vac or on the filter. I was impressed.

Next, I did a tougher test. I hooked the DD up between my DeWalt 733 planer and a larger 5HP Ridgid shop vac (emptied but with it's old filter). Surprisingly, the DD did quite well. I milled a 5" x 3' maple board and after 5-6 passes I had an inch or two of chips in the DD and just a spattering of chips in the bottom of the vac and on it's filter. There was some minor spitting of chips out the front of the planer, however, I get a little of that without the DD.


Dust Deputy connected to DeWalt planer. If I would make this a permanent installation I'd replace the black vac hose with larger DC hose and use a 20 gallon trash can.



Chips in shop vac after planing a board.



Chips in DD bucket after planing. You can also see the DD installation on the lid.

Overall, I''m impressed. I don't know whether I'll get another DD for the planer and jointer, or construct a Thien type separator like Kenbo just did. Whichever I do, I plan to use a 20 gallon trash can for a container as a 5 gallon would fill up real quick on those machines.

Bill
 

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nice set-up and write-up. we use two of them on our ROS daily, connected to fein shop vacs. the shop vacs have the 1 mic filter with the bags. we have not had to empty them yet after one year. and, the suction has not lowered any that we can tell. we have emptied the dd several times.
 

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Very nice write-up. I'm glad someone is having better luck with their DD. I have one hooked up on the top of a 30-gall poly drum and a 6.5 HP Rigid Shop Vac and apparently it sucks so strong that the dust gets sucked into the shop vac before it has a chance to fall out into the drum. I was told the problem was a leak, so I decided to block off the inlet going into the DD. It actually caved in my poly drum, thus ruling out the leak theory. This past weekend I placed a hose extension through the inlet down into the drum to see if this will help, though I haven't has a chance to test it.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Mark,

If you think you have too much suction, maybe you could experiment with a smaller shop vac or partially block the one you're using between the DD and the vac. Or open a hole between the two to cut the suction - again, just to experiment. I'm certainly not an expert - just spit-balling here.

What machine is it hooked up to? Could the machine itself be restrictive to flow?

Bill
 

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Mark,

If you think you have too much suction, maybe you could experiment with a smaller shop vac or partially block the one you're using between the DD and the vac. Or open a hole between the two to cut the suction - again, just to experiment. I'm certainly not an expert - just spit-balling here.

What machine is it hooked up to? Could the machine itself be restrictive to flow?

Bill
Bill, thanks for your comments. I havent't tried with another shop vac as I don't have one readily available. I might be able to create a leak somehow between the DD & the SV. That a good thought. As for the equipment, it is the same regardless of using the atatchment for cleaning the floor, the table saw or the jointer. All have 4" connections. However, I have to neck down to 2" (or so) as thats what the DD is.
 

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my wish ...

I wish that the cyclone collection, bucket and hoses could be integrated into the top of the shop vac. This would free up a lot of floor space and eliminate a tangle of hoses. I have in mind somehting like a top hat with the Thein separator.


I don't know if this separator would be as effective as a cyclone, but even if not, it would still better than a shop vac filter clogged up all the time. On my 4" DC flex pipe, I use a barrel cover like this on a 30 gal drum and it takes up lots of floor space. The shop vac filters are always clogged. Probably a good fall/winter project... :blink:

http://www.ptreeusa.com/dustacces.htm#399
 

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Discussion Starter #8
<<DD made one that is on top of a systainer like box that goes right on top of a festool dust extractor. So close Bill. >>

Just like this:


Bill
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Woodnthings,

So you are saying that you are running your Thien style separator off of shop vacs - and it's letting enough dust through to clog the filters?

I was thinking of building a Thien separator for a 20 gal. trash can but if that much dust goes through, I'll try another DD first.

Burb - Another solution to your problem may be running two DD's in parallel on the same drum. But if that doesn't work you're throwing good money after bad.

Bill
 

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I'm glad it's working for you. Dust collection is pretty important. Nice write-up too. I can't wait until I finally figure out a decent shop layout so I can run permanent ductwork for my dust collector and stop relying solely on my shop vac (because it's easier right now).
 

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Very nice write-up. I'm glad someone is having better luck with their DD. I have one hooked up on the top of a 30-gall poly drum and a 6.5 HP Rigid Shop Vac and apparently it sucks so strong that the dust gets sucked into the shop vac before it has a chance to fall out into the drum. I was told the problem was a leak, so I decided to block off the inlet going into the DD. It actually caved in my poly drum, thus ruling out the leak theory. This past weekend I placed a hose extension through the inlet down into the drum to see if this will help, though I haven't has a chance to test it.
Hi Mark - can you post some pictures of your setup? I've been running a DD with a 6.5HP Shop-vac for about 2 years now and the only time I get stuff in the bag is when I fail to empty the bucket soon enough. At about 3/4 full it starts to pull dust from the bucket as well as from the tool.
I'm having trouble picturing a hose from the inlet down into the drum, the dust intake on the dd is on the side and the vacuum port is on the top.:blink:
 

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My Thien separator works great for me and many others. :) They are highly regarded for their efficiency and low cost and ease of construction. I have 2 one on each of my 4" DC and about to make a smaller one for my shop vac. :)
 

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jschaben said:
Hi Mark - can you post some pictures of your setup? I've been running a DD with a 6.5HP Shop-vac for about 2 years now and the only time I get stuff in the bag is when I fail to empty the bucket soon enough. At about 3/4 full it starts to pull dust from the bucket as well as from the tool.
I'm having trouble picturing a hose from the inlet down into the drum, the dust intake on the dd is on the side and the vacuum port is on the top.:blink:
Here are the 2 setups I've been using. The one with the cardboard drum uses a 4" connection from the drum to the TS or the jointer. The one with the blue poly drum & DD uses a 2+" hose to whatever. Usually smaller tools like my sander, oscillating sander, or hand power tools. I've also used this with the 4" hose and and adapter hooked to the TS/ jointer, but it always clogged.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I took a trip to Woodcraft today (about an hour drive but I felt like an excursion) and picked up another DD, plus some fittings that would let me piece together a Thien separator. On the way back I got a 20 gallon Rubbermaid 'Brute' trash can. They have pretty stiff sides that I hope won't collapse. I could have gone bigger but I'll have to lug the thing up the basement stairs and through the house when it's full.

I figure I'll make a 3/4" plywood top for the trash can and experiment with the DD on it. If that can't handle my planer, I'll change the top over to a Thien setup.

Here's two questions: 1) What's a good kind of seal/weatherstrip to use to seal the lid, and 2) Does anyone know if the DD has to be mounted above the center of the container? Could it be mounted offset to the side?

Incidentally, I was only at a Woodcraft store once before. It's like a toy store for woodworking hobbyists. Lots of stuff I can never afford but I had tons of fun looking around! I was drooling on the Rikon and Laguna bandsaws.

Bill
 

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It should be fine to mount anywhere, as the air movement is occurring in the dd, not the trash can.
 

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we have the actual 5 gal Oneida cans, there is no seal material. the suction pulls the lid down pretty good. i guess you could use thin ribber or foam if you wanted more seal.

my guess that although the turbulence in the cone is vacuum powered, it is still relying on gravity to drop the particles. so vertical installation should be considered - imho. could try horizontal as a test. how will you mount it lower, offset to the side?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Tim and Ryan - Thanks for your information.

Tim - When I was speaking of offset, I just meant mounting the DD off-center on the lid. The DD would still be vertical. I was just thinking of how I could position the trash can in relation to the tool it's connected to while maintaining short hoses and putting the DD closer to the lid's edge might help. It may affect how the chips pile up in the can.

You bring up an interesting question though. Is the action of the chips dropping into the bucket affected by gravity or is it all the vortex? Hmm.

Bill
 

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It's affected by gravity....flip it upside down and it won't work the same
 

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Tim and Ryan - Thanks for your information.

Tim - When I was speaking of offset, I just meant mounting the DD off-center on the lid. The DD would still be vertical. I was just thinking of how I could position the trash can in relation to the tool it's connected to while maintaining short hoses and putting the DD closer to the lid's edge might help. It may affect how the chips pile up in the can.

You bring up an interesting question though. Is the action of the chips dropping into the bucket affected by gravity or is it all the vortex? Hmm.

Bill
sorry, that was a duh moment - been havin a few of them lately.
 
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