[morrow95]

Good results after using the hand sander on the pieces - they cleaned up better than I thought. I think the problem is the color really sank down into the grain. The edges have not been sanded yet as I will be doing those by hand and going over the rest by hand as well - so these will end up much better then this picture.

Also, using the aircraft up close and really 'laying it on' seems to be working well on the base although the fumes are horrible. I am only doing a little at a time with that. Not looking forward to the sanding part of the base as it is together, but hopefully it isn't to bad.

Will check back in here and there as I get more done or have questions - thanks to everyone for the assistance so far.

 

[Steve Neul]

I hope you are right and it's just the stain that didn't come off. Sometimes if you sand a finish off it leaves some of the finish penetrated into the wood and when you stain it the color looks blotchy. If the color looks weird when you stain it you may need to do some more stripping.

 

[morrow95]

Used a card scraper and it really sped up the process on the base. Still have some sanding to do yet, but looking good so far.

So, now for staining opinions. I want to go with something a little lighter than it was originally as I think that would give it a nicer appearance. I could always put multiple coats on to make it darker.

I planned on minwax oil based. Is the conditioner really needed? Do you see better results using the conditioner?

Maybe the most important then is how to protect it once stained... I want this to look as good as possible and the chair will be used (as soon as I get my own pool table :smile

Open to suggestions from the veterans. This is another first time for me.

 

[cabinetman]

I don't think it's been established what the wood is. If it's one prone to blotching, a conditioner of some sort may be beneficial. As for staining, if you found a color in an oil base that a one time application was a winner (tried on a sample), that would be an easy finish. Trying to darken an oil base finish can affect how well a topcoat will adhere. Adding additional coats of stain will likely not achieve a desirable color increase.

Keep in mind that when making samples, take them to the final finish, whatever that may be. Just a stained piece will look different when a topcoat has been applied. Using a dye, will afford you the opportunity to apply additional coats.

Dyes can be wiped or sprayed on. If you are equipped to spray a finish (not a rattle can), that would be the way to go.

.

 

[Steve Neul]

To me it looks like it might be birch or maple. If it is then it does need the wood conditioner. If it isn't the wood conditioner wouldn't hurt anything so I would use it to be sure. Once you use the conditioner you will probably have purchase a darker color stain than you think. The conditioner will make it stain lighter because it will seal the wood a little. You could suppliment the color with a dye however as busy as the chair is it would be best to spray the dye. I don't think you would be able to apply the dye evenly by hand. You should not put multiple coats of an oil stain on. If you manage to get some of the stain left on the surface it can interfere with the adhesion of the topcoat. The type of topcoat would depend on what color the stain will be and if you have the means of spraying or not. If it is a medium color and can't spray I would use an oil based wipe on polyurethane. If the color is light I would go with a water based polyurethane. If you have the means of spraying I would seal with a vinyl sealer and topcoat with a pre-catalyzed lacquer. It would work on light or dark woods.

 

[morrow95]

Here are two pictures of the wood a little closer up... my thought is maple, however, there are parts of dark grey and green in spots... one leg for instance has a very noticeable army green color look to it. Is that characteristic of maple?

Color was going to be a little lighter than original as I want to show off the wood a bit and give it character instead of it looking like dark brown paint. From the comments I will be going with conditioner and oil-based.

I really do not have anything to test other than using one of the pieces I have already sanded. When using the conditioner does it still hold true that the longer you leave the stain before wiping the darker it will be?

Is it okay to stain part of a piece then do the other later? To me that just doesn't sounds like it would turn out well. I am curious as to how I can do these pieces as they are apart.

For finish, after doing some reading, I was thinking of a wipe on oil poly. This just seems the easiest to me as I will be able to do a few coats and wetsand/buff to a gloss (this is similar to a previous project I did and had fantastic results). I have seen conflicting information that oil based poly will yellow in time - is that true?

 

[Steve Neul]

The wood really looks like maple to me up close. The grey areas are just the grain of the wood. What you can do to test the finish is there are area where the seat will cover on the inside side of the rails. You can do your testing there. You are correct in that it's not good to test a small area and then try to continue later.

Much of the wipe on polyurethane is oil based. Since you are going light be sure to use a water based wipe on poly. It will be harder to work but the oil based will yellow as it ages. If the stain you use doesn't even out the color for you, you can use dyes to suppliment the color. I expect wood like the bottom picture will be much lighter then the wood in the top picture. Don't use multiple coats of an oil stain and if you use an oil stain let it dry three days before applying a water based topcoat.

 

[morrow95]

So the oil-based poly will yellow and I don't want that. Is it still okay to use oil-based conditioner and stain with water based poly?

I am not necessarily going light, but just lighter than the extremely dark/brown it was originally. Looking at the minwax site I was thinking English chestnut or dark walnut as it won't go on as dark with the conditioner.

 

[Steve Neul]

The english chestnut stain is dark enough you could use an oil based poly if you wish. It doesn't yellow very much and is really only a issue on light colored woods like natural maple. You don't see it on medium to dark colored woods.

To answer your question, you can use an oil based conditioner and topcoat it with a water based poly but you should let the conditioner and stain dry three days to a week before topcoating. The finish doesn't adhere very well to fresh linseed oil but is fine once it dries. If you didn't want to wait you could put a coat of zinsser sealcoat shellac on after you have it stained and when it dries procede with the water based poly. The sealcoat would work as a barrier coat. It would adhere to the fresh stain and the water based poly would adhere to the sealcoat.

 

[morrow95]

In that case I am sticking to the original plan of all oil-based for conditioner, stain, and poly. The oil poly should be a little thicker from what I've read and would be easier to wet sand/buff after a couple coats.

Unless anyone wants to sway me differently I will report back after I get some stuff more done. Thanks again for all the help.

Need to decide between the English chestnut and dark walnut as well - worried the walnut might be too dark and not show off some of the wood highlights. Then again I am going to have the seat and back redone in black leather so the walnut might match better. Decisions.

 

[morrow95]

I'm back... I tested the stain on these two braces tonight as I will screw these on after separately due to them being extremely close to the chair corner braces.

This is with minwax pre-conditioner and minwax walnut gel stain. I put it on with a brush and then wiped off pretty much immediately afterwards. Even though it was only a few minutes it did take a little elbow grease to wipe off.

I am glad I got the darker walnut as the conditioner really lightened it up. The can says I can put more coats on after 8-10 hours which I am debating on trying. I figure tomorrow I will give it another look and see what I think. My gut is telling me to go one more coat and just get it slightly darker than current.

Anyways, the new question. Since the rest of the chair is assembled... what is the best process of staining. Obviously I won't be able to stain the whole thing then go back and wipe it off. If I stain sections, wipe off, and move to another section is that going to cause noticeable spots where two different sections overlapped and were done at different times?

 

[BernieL]

Those pieces look good... nice job. I would strip all the pieces and stain them all at the same time for best consistency. Put that card scraper to work and finish the strip process. If the card scraper gets dull, try learning how to sharpen it. It will be worth the effort. There are a few ways of doing that and you can search the methods and see which works best for you. The instructions will tell you to crush the square edge with a burnishing tool. If you don't have one, a wide flat head screw driver can serve do the job.

 

[Steve Neul]

I would work on the chair early in the morning before it gets hot and brush another coat of the gel stain on as thin as possible with a soft brush and just let it dry. When it gets hot the stain will set up much faster. Anyway it's not like an oil stain where you have to wipe the excess off. You can just leave it and it will adhere. The main thing is that you get a uniform coat over it.

 

[morrow95]

Well I just put the first coat of wipe on poly on the chair. Why would the poly cause the stain to get lighter in specific spots and even entire areas?

The stain was most certainly dry - 36 hours - and there is no color on the white wipe rag other than some yellow from the poly.

This is ridiculous... I noticed it not long after putting it on and it does not look good. Is sanding this coat of poly off and staining more an option at this point?

 

[Steve Neul]

Not having the product instructions I could only guess that either the wood conditioner shouldn't have been used or using a gel stain the conditioner should have been allowed to dry completely. Some conditioners say to apply the stain within 30 minutes but that would apply to a wiping stain and it kept the gel stain from bonding well. Without being there a guess is the best I can do. When it's dry you can scuff sand it and apply more gel stain to the light spots but before you do that let it dry and briskly rub it with a clean cloth and see if the finish comes off. It might be necessary to take the gel stain and your first coat off and re-apply the gel stain.