Monster table saw, outfeed, flip top, bench table - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 03-23-2020, 03:24 AM Thread Starter
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Monster table saw, outfeed, flip top, bench table

I have a limited 20x20 garage. Everything in my shop already is on or will be on wheels. I have the Ridgid 3650 and I love it. I'd like to incorporate it into a rolling bench with drawers for storage like what Phil did (Capture2). I already have the bench dog router table extension.
Then I also wanted to make a flip top cart for my belt sander and planer, also on wheels.
Then I thought I would either make an outfeed table or rig up one on the backside of my table saw which has been done fairly often.
Then...I thought with the gears turning, why not make one big a$$ table for all of it. I came across (capture) and didn't even think about making it go in the direction of the outfeed. Most table saw benches have them along the length. I wouldn't need the miter saw since I'll have a separate miter bench.
The table could function as flip top as well, having sections to be a smooth surface on one side, tool on the other (Capture4). Note how the planer goes again in the direction of the length of the table for outfeed.
Since my table saw is wide (about 64") that gives me plenty of space for say T track assembly/clamping on one half of it (Capture3). It would be a serious undertaking for my skill level, and I bet it would weigh a ton, but it would make ONE table to rule them all. Table saw/outfeed, router, planer, belt sander, work surface of total 64"x (however long)", and drawers underneath for saw blades, small things lie hand sanders, clamps, etc.

Am I crazy, is it too big? too heavy? I mean the saw alone is super heavy bc the cast iron top, but I can manage that myself easily.
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post #2 of 12 Old 03-28-2020, 08:30 AM
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I have no idea of what you do and what you have made so far.
Do you make toys?, furniture? misc. small projects?
Have you made a lot of stuff yet or are you beginning.
If you have already built a lot of projects, you would be the one best to consult based on your experience in your shop.
If you have not made a lot of stuff yet, I would suggest you start making things before you decide on what you need. Your experience will tell you what you need.
I have had many shops both large and small and different shaped. Each one had it's own specific work benches, out-feed tables and assembly tables. I build mostly furniture. Each shop layout was dictated by the most efficient use of space and the tools I had on hand at the time.
Build some projects with temporary tables and benches. Bolt them together so you can disassemble and reuse the materials when you decide what you finally want. After about your 10th project, you will pretty much know what you want and need. Remember one thing - YOU need space to work in and your projects will need space to live in during various phases of construction.

Best of luck on whatever you decide.
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post #3 of 12 Old 03-29-2020, 01:17 AM Thread Starter
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The garage is where I'll make things like closet organizers, cabinets, small decoration items, random things (wine press, home renovations, etc). The thing I definitely need is an outfeed of some sort. I'm also planning a big cabinet project, so I'll need 4x8 outfeed capability for that, clamping station, pocket hole station. The mention about the flip cart was for storage. I don't have a large area so I figured that making the outfeed also a flip would help store my planer (used for barn doors, dining table), belt sander, and maybe one other tool.
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post #4 of 12 Old 03-29-2020, 06:12 AM
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If it were me, and it was at times, I would make the outfeed table 4' wide and no longer than around 4 1/2' long. That would be long enough for an 8' sheet of plywood to land on without danger of it sliding off the end. Keep in mind that in small working quarters, you will still need room for these mobile benches to swing around in to get them out of the way. My outfeed tables were always my assembly tables. I had 4 x 8 outfeed/assembly tables in my shops before, but that was in the larger shops. You could even get away with a 4' x 4 1/2' outfeed table with a flip up top on the end. That would buy you anothet 2 1/2 feet for a total 7' long.
In smaller shops, a lot of thought has to go into them.
I would have a permanently mounted Chop Saw or Radial Arm Saw against one wall. Then your cabinets could be the base unit for those saws and also cabinets above them.
I have always stored my lumber and plywood vertically. My plywood rack was slightly tilted backwards just enough so that the boards would not fall forward. That way, i could back up against the rack, reach behind me, pull a sheet forward to rest against my back. Then with my arms behind me, I would grab the plywood, bend slightly and lift it a few inches off the ground and walk away with the sheet on my back while standing upright only slightly bent forward. Now comes the part you want to do in complete privacy. Walk toward the table saw with the plywood on your back, drop down to your knees, lean forward and tilt the plywood so that the upper part rests on the edge of your table saw. Crawl out from underneath it and begin your sawing. I dont know if this will work in most garages due to ceiling height restrictions. I love vertical storage. Much easier to get boards in and out without major re-shuffling like in horizontal storage. The photos below were in my shop in a 10' x 30' self storage facility. This was my lumber rack. My Plywood rack was on the opposite wall - if I can the pics, I will post them.
There exists a thing-a-ma-jig called the Crazy Horse Dolly for moving large sheets of plywood. You can find it on youtube.com. Great idea. Problem is that I dont think it would work in small areas like a garage cluttered with benches, but worth a look.
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Last edited by Tony B; 03-29-2020 at 06:19 AM.
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post #5 of 12 Old 03-29-2020, 06:36 AM
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Here is the same shop, with an outfeed table 4' x 7'? laid in a different direction - along side the rear of the table saw. Even though it is only 4 ft. 'long' on the outfeed end, 4x8 sheets of plywood never fell off of it - just push it slowly and carefully through the blade. It gains in the leverage department by considering the length of the table saw top behind the blade and a slight separation between the table saw top and the outfeed/assembly table.
You will also notice the roll of butcher paper mounted on a pipe on the assembly table. The paper is used for protecting the top of the workbench from glue spills and also for full scale drawings when needed for payout work. Dont be cheap with the paper, use it as you need it and throw it away when done, It will still last well over a year or three for a hobbyist. I never get around to laminating the top with Formica on this particular assembly table
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post #6 of 12 Old 03-29-2020, 07:21 AM
where's my table saw?
 
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Combination outfeed and assembly table .....




Disregard the 3 table saws attached to each other, but the idea here is to run the assembly/outfeed or A/O, table the long way behind the saw with a "bridge" in between with the miter slot dados. My "bridge " is permanent, but a flip down bridge would work in a smaller shop. You can make both the saw support stand AND the A/O table mobile if that works best, or just one. Which one would depend on your shop layout.

The biggest issue in my experience, and I'm on a wood joist floor for this shop, is that concrete in not level enough for mobile tables unless you have adjustable feet/pads along with your casters. You always need a smooth transition from your table saw to your A/O table. Even a 1/16" bump or difference in height to the A/O table will prevent the work piece from sliding onto the A/O table. I had such a bump develop over a 10 year period from the joists settling an even though both the saw and the A/O table were level, they weren't at the same height, the A/O being 1/16" higher. That meant raising the saw or lowering the A/O table and corresponding connecting bridge. It was a PITA to get them close enough for a smooth transition.

A solution is to make the outfeed support a flip up so it's always attached to the saw itself and have a separate assembly table, which is not used in conjunction with the saw for the most part. An assembly table which is 1/8" to 1/4" lower would allow for the workpiece to drop slightly and then slide without interference.

Ok, that's the biggest issue when working with unlevel floors and 2 different mobile tables.
I store almost all my lumber, mostly hardwood vertically, like Tony B.
I do not have a place to store plywood in this shop, but down below in the garage which is another PITA, unique to my situation. My wood shop is on the second floor which means I need to break down the plywood into manageable sizes to get the piece up the stairs. Humping a full 4 X 8 sheet upstairs is just not going to happen without help.

If in your case, you could break down the plywood on a separate support surface like saw horses, before it gets to the table saw, that would save you having a long outfeed on the table saw. However, ripping an 8 ft long sheet, whether it's a or board or plank, still requires about 18 ft of straight run in any case. A front support is always best as well as an outfeed support. I use H-F roller stands occasionally, but they are not very stable. I made a large crosscut guide for 4 X 8 panels from 1 X's and Masonite. The Masonite was attached under the cross piece leaving an extra 1" and then the saw was passed over it leaving a zero clearance, no measure guide. This is not shown in this post, but added later based on a suggestion:
https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f27/...476/#post82269

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)

Last edited by woodnthings; 03-29-2020 at 07:25 AM.
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post #7 of 12 Old 03-29-2020, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post



Disregard the 3 table saws attached to each other.....................,[/URL]
How does one disregard 3 table saws attached to each other? LOL

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post #8 of 12 Old 03-30-2020, 12:39 AM Thread Starter
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Good pointers on the outfeed not needing to be very big for a full sheet. I suppose it could be 3'x5' with a flip up 2 footer at the edge for a max of 7. I would mount my planer in the direction of the length. One thought I had was for simplicity, don't even have flip tops but rather threaded insert nuts at the places I would mount them. A flip cart would be ideal since it's USE and STORAGE. But I'm worried about just how even of a surface i'd be able to make with the support framing and flip surface lining up just right. I use my portable worktables as a make shift outfeed and if the wood just catches even the slightest groove on them, it screws up my whole operation.

And three table saws...I'm curious.
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post #9 of 12 Old 03-30-2020, 05:00 AM
where's my table saw?
 
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Sawzilla, 3 table saws attached w/2 spare tables

Quote:
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.......

And three table saws...I'm curious.

Since you asked.
I can't find my table saw(s)

I started out with two 12" identical motorized table saws back in the 90's "on sale" from Sears. These were the good ones that ran on 220 volts and had 3 HP motors. At some point I thought it would be cool to attach them together, but the cabinets had a motor bump out that prevented them from being side by side, a spacer was needed in between. I found a spare table which was 20" wide and that solved the problem. Then I found another 12" saw on Craigs List "for parts" ..... and they are rare, so I picked it up and needed a place to store it. That's when it hit me, to attach it to the left of the other two, but same issue as before, needed another spare 20" table for a spacer. Found a spare and the rest is history. BYW, there's a Big Dog cast iron router extension table on the far right side which adds another 24" to the width. So, total width of Sawzilla is 10 ft.


There are others here who attached their cast iron saws side by side.
It gives you the 52" rip capacity of a cabinet saw at a much cheaper price, buying used. Ledhead was in town on business and dropped in, saw my set up went home and made his own twin saw:
https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f2/b...w-build-29460/





I hate changing saw blades, so a have a dado set on the right, a 50 tooth combination in the center and a 24 tooth rip on the left. 90% of the time I use the center saw but it sure is nice to have the extra width:
100 2515 Crosscutting the panel at 48" wide.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #10 of 12 Old 03-30-2020, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mendozer View Post
Then...I thought with the gears turning, why not make one big a$$ table for all of it.
all-in-one solutions rarely work well. i'd separate tools on separate stands vs one big one. even a router/table saw combo rarely works without a lot of setup time. imo drawers near/under a table saw will fill with sawdust
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post #11 of 12 Old 04-01-2020, 08:39 PM Thread Starter
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all-in-one solutions rarely work well. i'd separate tools on separate stands vs one big one. even a router/table saw combo rarely works without a lot of setup time. imo drawers near/under a table saw will fill with sawdust
So since the 3650 doesn't have an enclosed base like the newer version, which is my only gripe, I was going to modify the setup to channel the dust into the space just below the saw housing. I don't plan on having a ton of drawers, just stuff for blades, push sticks, featherboards, etc. I am leaning more towards the Table saw/router cart + outfeed/workbench cart idea. I took a 64"x72" measurement in that area after allowing 30" for the miter station plus 3 feet standing room in between and it surpassed the midway point, which I don't want. So maybe the outfeed will be 36"x48" plus a fold up 24" shelf for a grand total of 6' long. That way I can still maneuver a 4x8 sheet on the 3x6 surface if needed instead of working on 2x4s on the ground.
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post #12 of 12 Old 04-01-2020, 11:20 PM
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What I saw in the first picture is the way I would go.

EXCEPT

I would move the saw more toward the center. (Or toward the right.) Better stability.

The casters are probably about the best that you will find.

HOWEVER

After sitting on a concrete floor for 8 or 10 years the red urethane will crack or deteriorate and the caster will need to be replaced. DAMHIKT Be sure that your design will give you access to the mounting screws/bolts for the casters.

Rich
In furniture 1/32" is a Grand Canyon
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