mid-way thru vanity project - sagging top! - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
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post #1 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 03:32 PM Thread Starter
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mid-way thru vanity project - sagging top!

It's my first time building a vanity and I'm using some modified plans from an issue of Woodsmith Magazine. I built the box last summer, and I'm just now getting ready to build a face frame + drawers/doors when I noticed a fairly substantial sag in the top piece of plywood spanning the vanity. Part of this is due to my dimensions being slightly off...and perhaps part of it is due to time/craftsmanship...but at its sagging "peak" (in the middle of the vanity), I have just under 1/4" drop compared to the sides.

Installing the face frame on level will mean that the frame rises above the vanity box itself in the middle...and I'm also getting ready to have a granite countertop installed soon. Any recommendations on how to fix this?! Should I just install the face frame level and even with the corners...and then shim the middle? I don't like the idea of the granite not being well supported throughout...but I'm wracking my brain to come up with a good solution. Any and all ideas are appreciated!
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post #2 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 06:50 PM
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Short of trying to straighten the top by applying a counter force to it, you could add another top of ply or mdf and shim between the new to and the old top. The face frame could cover the edges of both tops and you'd have full support for the granite.
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post #3 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 06:53 PM
where's my table saw?
 
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you have to break it loose

Tap underneath the top with a plastic mallet or a wooden block and break the glue joints free. Bring the top up to your level using clamps. Then insert wedges into the gap and reglue. Your verticals are less tall than the ends for some reason.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #4 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 07:18 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post
Tap underneath the top with a plastic mallet or a wooden block and break the glue joints free. Bring the top up to your level using clamps. Then insert wedges into the gap and reglue. Your verticals are less tall than the ends for some reason.
I didn't realize breaking the glue joints was a possibility. Do you think that would affect my joints on the two ends? (see pics)
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post #5 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 07:37 PM
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If it were mine...not thankfully!

I would turn the unit over or upside down on a flat surface and then try to tap the joints free. The resistance to rebound will be better and easier to smack downward than upward.

If the opposite side/bottom comes loose, no problem, but you need to assertain which side will break free the easiest for putting in the shims/wedges.

I have heard that vinegar or hot water will help soften PVC glues...I donno? Search it.

Not certain what you are showing in the second photo?

Lesson learned here: after cutting measure again to be certain everything is spot on before assembly. A dry fit is good practice and good practice.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #6 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 07:42 PM
more bacon?
 
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As a granite guy I can tell you I would much prefer a cabinet with a back or stretcher and no top, to a cabinet with a plywood deck and no back.
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post #7 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ttharp View Post
As a granite guy I can tell you I would much prefer a cabinet with a back or stretcher and no top, to a cabinet with a plywood deck and no back.
????????

You are saying what?

George
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post #8 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 08:57 PM Thread Starter
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Alright...going to try breaking the glue joints and setting this thing free!
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post #9 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
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???????? You are saying what? George
That I would not put a full deck on a cabinet receiving granite. Also I like full backs on cabinets.

I am not sure what was unclear about my statement.
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post #10 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 11:56 PM Thread Starter
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Top is off! Great advice. Unfortunately (because of the previous joints and the tear out) the existing plywood for the top won't be reused. Lesson learned.

Any reason why I couldn't just use some MDF for the new support top, instead of buying another sheet of cabinet grade ply?
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post #11 of 22 Old 03-12-2015, 11:58 PM Thread Starter
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Also I went ahead and cut each divider/end piece precisely the same height. So the next piece "should" go on flawlessly. Fingers crossed!
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post #12 of 22 Old 03-13-2015, 01:00 AM
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tharp's advice

You don't need a top. The granite is stiff enough to span the distance between the supports. You will need a full back on the cabinet base and the verticals must all be the same height....? You just need a face frame across the front. I would span the center section with a piece of plywood leveled out across the ends and not use an entire sheet. You can salvage it from the other top.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #13 of 22 Old 03-13-2015, 02:25 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks Woodnthings. Really appreciate the help! Will definitely put a backing on it.

When you say salvage the plywood and span it across the center section...do you mean attach it to the top, laying it over/across the vertical cabinet dividers...or do you mean attach some plywood pieces flush with the top of the vertical dividers? I'm just a little confused when you said I don't need a top but to use the plywood and lay it across. Thanks for any clarification!
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post #14 of 22 Old 03-13-2015, 07:33 AM
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What would really help the cabinet is put a toe kick 6" to 8" back from the front. You could paint it black so it doesn't show but recessed back behind the legs it shouldn't show anyway. A back on the cabinet would also be good.
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post #15 of 22 Old 03-13-2015, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Neul View Post
What would really help the cabinet is put a toe kick 6" to 8" back from the front. You could paint it black so it doesn't show but recessed back behind the legs it shouldn't show anyway. A back on the cabinet would also be good.
I second this, without support in the center of the cabinet, under the bottom of the center uprights it will still sag. If you like, you can put the toe kick back in the center instead of the front of the cabinet. It doesn't have to run all the way from side to side as long as the two uprights are supported. That may have been your problem all along, the bottom could have been sagging also, you might want to check that. JMHO

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post #16 of 22 Old 03-13-2015, 04:56 PM
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"Any reason why I couldn't just use some MDF for the new support top, instead of buying another sheet of cabinet grade ply?"

Don't use MDF ANYWHERE where there will be moisture.
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post #17 of 22 Old 03-14-2015, 03:58 AM Thread Starter
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Gosh, really appreciate all the help here. Really would have been lost without all the great advice!

I went ahead and popped the top, resized the verticals, built a base under the verticals, and attached a 3" support rail going over the perimeter & verticals. Putting the face frame on now, and back panel tomorrow.

I'll be sure to post a picture in the morning! Thanks again to all who helped.
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post #18 of 22 Old 03-16-2015, 03:46 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks to everyone who gave advice! Couldn't have done it without all the great feedback. Next step: doors and drawers. Oh boy.
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post #19 of 22 Old 03-16-2015, 04:27 PM
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I hope it's the photograph angle ....

I don't know if the sides are different heights, BUT it sure looks that way in the photo. Please tell me it ain't so.

The left side looks taller/longer.....

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)

Last edited by woodnthings; 03-16-2015 at 07:17 PM.
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post #20 of 22 Old 03-16-2015, 04:40 PM
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Naw the right side looks shorter then the left side................LOL:thumbs up:
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