Out-of-Square Fix?? - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
 
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post #1 of 14 Old 09-07-2013, 12:09 PM Thread Starter
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Out-of-Square Fix??

To say I'm a beginning woodworker is an understatement of massive proportions. The photo shows my assembled but unfinished quilt rack lying on one end. It was in this position that I noticed that it was out of square in the plan view dimension. When I assembled and glued it up I was concerned about squareness in the standing orientation but never considered the plan orientation. The rack measures about 27" long and 35" tall. In the plan orientation (photo), it is about 1/2" out of square. All joinery is mortise and tenon with dowels securing the two upper rails where they join the side frames.

I have little hope for a real fix here, but I have to ask if anyone has any suggestions for fixing this disaster?
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post #2 of 14 Old 09-07-2013, 12:39 PM
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Is one side wider than the other, or is the length of the rails? Sorry, I can't tell from the pic.

"I long for the days when coke was a cola and a joint was a bad place to be" (Merle Haggard)
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post #3 of 14 Old 09-08-2013, 07:42 AM Thread Starter
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Out-Of-Square Fix??

As the quilt rack stands upright, the rack is perfectly square in the front dimension. The three rails (2 upper and 1 lower) are all the same length. It's when I lay the rack on one of its side frames (photo view) that I noticed the trapezoidal shape of the plan (overhead) view. In the photo the rails lean a half inch to the right of the side frame it is resting on. The trapezoidal shape is more prominent at the top of the rack than at the bottom. Hope this helps. (My wife, for whom I'm making this quilt rack, happened to walk into my shop just as I was noticing the out-of-square and I made the mistake of explaining it to her. She may never have noticed had I kept my trap shut!)
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post #4 of 14 Old 09-08-2013, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twokamprs View Post
As the quilt rack stands upright, the rack is perfectly square in the front dimension. The three rails (2 upper and 1 lower) are all the same length. It's when I lay the rack on one of its side frames (photo view) that I noticed the trapezoidal shape of the plan (overhead) view. In the photo the rails lean a half inch to the right of the side frame it is resting on. The trapezoidal shape is more prominent at the top of the rack than at the bottom. Hope this helps. (My wife, for whom I'm making this quilt rack, happened to walk into my shop just as I was noticing the out-of-square and I made the mistake of explaining it to her. She may never have noticed had I kept my trap shut!)

That is a rule of woodworking, never point out defects to the wife. She'll pick them out eventually. And then again there is a small chance she might miss it.

Regards, Pat
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post #5 of 14 Old 09-08-2013, 08:19 AM
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When things like that happen in my shop, they're labeled 'design enhancements'
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post #6 of 14 Old 09-08-2013, 09:13 AM
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My guess is that your rack racks. Could be you have one or more joints that are loose enough to permit movement. For fixes, you could drill and insert dowels with glue. Or, install some decorative corner gussets between the horizontal and vertical members.






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post #7 of 14 Old 09-08-2013, 09:41 AM
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Well, I asked because (to my eyes) the side at the top in the pic looks like it may be wider than the side that's on the bottom. If true, you might be able to move the mortise on the top section (as you look at in the pic) to the left, maybe 1/4", an on the bottom to the right 1/4". You "move" a mortise by either filling the old one in and re cutting it, or just widen it and pad one side with a filler. Moving them 1/4" should still leave enough shoulder to cover the repair (?).

"I long for the days when coke was a cola and a joint was a bad place to be" (Merle Haggard)
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post #8 of 14 Old 09-09-2013, 07:44 AM Thread Starter
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Out-Of-Square Fix??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Hargis View Post
Well, I asked because (to my eyes) the side at the top in the pic looks like it may be wider than the side that's on the bottom. If true, you might be able to move the mortise on the top section (as you look at in the pic) to the left, maybe 1/4", an on the bottom to the right 1/4". You "move" a mortise by either filling the old one in and re cutting it, or just widen it and pad one side with a filler. Moving them 1/4" should still leave enough shoulder to cover the repair (?).
Thanks for the input. I'm think I'm in a salvage and redo mode...some day.
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post #9 of 14 Old 09-09-2013, 07:45 AM Thread Starter
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Out-Of-Square Fix??

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That is a rule of woodworking, never point out defects to the wife. She'll pick them out eventually. And then again there is a small chance she might miss it.
Lesson learned!!
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post #10 of 14 Old 09-09-2013, 08:30 AM
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please check again

My eyes tell me that the vertical on the left is shorter than the vertical on the right. The lower/center one may or may not be different, but that one won' t give you the issue you have. You can't lengthen the shorter one, so plan on shortening the longer one...hah hah


If that's the case and you want to "fix" it, see if you can "whack" the side panels off using a dead blow plastic mallet or a block of wood and regular hammer. A sharp blow will usually break the glue bond and allow it to be pulled apart. Then compare the length of the stretchers and make them the same. This would drive me nuts....just sayin'

I built a quilt rack myself, so I know the issues involved:
http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/membe...on-quilt-rack/

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)

Last edited by woodnthings; 09-09-2013 at 05:17 PM.
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post #11 of 14 Old 09-09-2013, 08:43 AM
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I can respect that you want your project to be perfect as it can be. Got some good advice on a fix. However, as a quilt rack, when used as such under normal viewing, that 1/2 inch will never be noticed. I'd put it in the room, put a quilt over it, tell the wife it's done and move on to the next project.
Just my 2 cents.
Good Luck
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post #12 of 14 Old 09-09-2013, 04:47 PM
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Famous Thos. Chippindale quote:

"Make a break front out of it".

Yeah,it's a joke but....there is a slight ring of truth in there.

Those who say it cannot be done shouldn't interrupt the people doing it.
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post #13 of 14 Old 09-09-2013, 06:37 PM
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I'm not experienced by any means, but it looks like your tenon shoulders are square. In the pic, the top ones have a gap on the right, and the bottom ones have a gap on the left, which would confirm your leaning to the right. If you can break the glue like woodnthings suggested, you may be able to recut your mortices.
If the glue won't break, I don't know how possible it is, but you might be able to flush cut your stretchers and cut new mortices to the side, where the old holes will still be under the shoulders, but so you're not trying to cut a hole on top of your old hole.
Hopefully that made sense! :)

Good luck,
Acer
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post #14 of 14 Old 09-10-2013, 07:36 AM Thread Starter
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Out-Of-Square Fix??

You've convinced me to try to save the work. It can't hurt to try breaking apart the joints, cleaning them up, reassembling and this time us the old diagonal measure method to square up the plan view of the rack. Wish me luck and thanks for your input.

Quote:
Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post
My eyes tell me that the vertical on the left is shorter than the vertical on the right. The lower/center one may or may not be different, but that one won' t give you the issue you have. You can't lengthen the shorter one, so plan on shortening the longer one...hah hah


If that's the case and you want to "fix" it, see if you can "whack" the side panels off using a dead blow plastic mallet or a block of wood and regular hammer. A sharp blow will usually break the glue bond and allow it to be pulled apart. Then compare the length of the stretchers and make them the same. This would drive me nuts....just sayin'

I built a quilt rack myself, so I know the issues involved:
http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/membe...on-quilt-rack/
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