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post #1 of 20 Old 07-04-2014, 12:31 PM Thread Starter
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Not sure how to join these

Making just a small 3" x 3" box about 6" tall. The walls are made up of 1/8" hardwood. Not sure how to join the 4 sides together since there's such little surface to work with. The only thing I can think of is glue and brads. New to joinery so any ideas would be most appreciated.
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post #2 of 20 Old 07-04-2014, 03:44 PM
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Alright, I don't know the purpose of this box, how good it has to be, what's going inside it, etc. One thing that comes to mind is to cut some 1/4" x 1/4" strips and use them inside along all of the joints as gluing blocks, or cleats. Glue them to one side first, then assemble the adjacent sides to it. It will give you 3x the gluing surface. Another approach is to spread the wood glue on the gluing surfaces, put them together, and apply a few drops of ca glue along the joint and hold in place for a minute. The ca glue will hold things together while the wood glue dries. You won't get any clamping pressure this way, but if the box is not subjected to strong forces, it should hold up okay. I have done this with small boxes (pull out drawers) in a sewing cabinet and they have held up for over 20 years.
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post #3 of 20 Old 07-04-2014, 03:59 PM
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Going to have a hard time no matter what with material that thin. If your opposed to adding some extra area with something like a square dowel. You might try some construction adhesive
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post #4 of 20 Old 07-04-2014, 11:54 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the suggestions. The box is going to be used for my wife to store makeup brushes so low stress. I may just try mitering the corners and tacking then putting glue on the joint and hope for the best. It shouldn't be subject to extreme stresses. If it does break then I can try the square dowel in each corner to add glueing surface area. Thanks for the tip.
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post #5 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 01:29 AM
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Do some research to determine what new tool you would like to buy. Explain to your wife that you need this tool to completer this project for her. It doesn't matter whether you actually need it for this project or not. What is important is to instill in her that you need tools to make things for her. No project can ever be completed without at least one new tool acquisition. This approach has kept my marriage sound for over 40 years. It has reached the point that my wife will occasionally ask me if there is some new tool I need whether she has a project in mind or not.

This project cries out for hand cut dovetails, so you will need a dovetail saw and some chisels. And a mallet.

Last edited by RogerInColorado; 07-05-2014 at 01:32 AM.
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post #6 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 02:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerInColorado View Post
Do some research to determine what new tool you would like to buy. Explain to your wife that you need this tool to completer this project for her. It doesn't matter whether you actually need it for this project or not. What is important is to instill in her that you need tools to make things for her. No project can ever be completed without at least one new tool acquisition. This approach has kept my marriage sound for over 40 years. It has reached the point that my wife will occasionally ask me if there is some new tool I need whether she has a project in mind or not.

This project cries out for hand cut dovetails, so you will need a dovetail saw and some chisels. And a mallet.
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Thanks for the suggestions. The box is
going to be used for my wife to store makeup brushes so low stress. I may just try mitering the corners and tacking then putting glue on the joint and hope for the best. It shouldn't be subject to extreme stresses. If it does break then I can try the square dowel in each corner to add glueing surface area. Thanks for the tip.
Assuming a perfect 45 degree miter joint in each corner, this leaves you with .18 inches of glue area. You may be able to get away with it if the box is never, ever touched. If your wife is anywhere near a quarter as bad as my girlfriend, itll never work. This is going to sound rude, but im rather fond of a saying my old manager used to use:
If you dont have time to do it right, when are you going to have time to do it over.

Apologies for sounding pretentious, but redoing a project because you did something and hoped it would work and it didnt is one of the worst feelings a maker can have, because the entire time youre working the second time its a loop of "you idiot, you shouldve done it this way the first time" in the head. Just trying to save you some frustration
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post #7 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 03:08 AM
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If you're not comfortable with dovetails I would suggest box joints. Can be done with TS or router table and gives a lot more glue area

Cut it twice, measure once and it's still too short.
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post #8 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 06:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unclefester View Post
If you're not comfortable with dovetails I would suggest box joints. Can be done with TS or router table and gives a lot more glue area
+1. This would work if you can keep from breaking off the fingers.





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post #9 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 07:29 AM
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With 1/8" thick material no joint is going to be great. I would just miter it and just glue the joint without fasteners. If you could put some kind of corner blocks on the inside it would help a lot.
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post #10 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 07:59 AM
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Hi hokeyplyr48

I recall quite a few years back now having a go at making some boxes and though I don't have it now, the following book helped me learn abit more (from amazon)

http://www.amazon.com/Box-Making-Bas...rds=box+making

Actually got the inspiration from finewoodworking.com - checked on there today and saw they have some free articles and stuff related to box making more so the users gallery showing examples of work with close up shots - great for seeing and getting ideas. Great example here some made several box - http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/112622/boxes

One idea was thinking with such a thin material is double it up, add an internal liner which sits just above the outer but provides a tight seal for the lid - similar to this one (although its bigger) http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...as-jewelry-box - glue the outer and inner material together, doubling the thickness - either mitre, dovetail or rabbet and pin to join at corners. Your internal liner would be slightly wider than outer.

Just came across this other user gallery box, a grade 10 class project with pinned rabbet joints - http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-intro-project

There lots ways of making them boxes for sure - some great ideas out there.

Have a great weekend,
David

Last edited by Techelpdave; 07-05-2014 at 08:05 AM.
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post #11 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 08:06 PM
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not sure how to join these

why not try 1/4'' material, miter your corners, glue & brad them? From experience, & also having a wife, 1/8" material will probably not last past the first time it hits the bottom of her sink, or the floor! Nor will it hold brads or anything else but glue, MAYBE. I would also suggest using a waterproof glue, simply because it will stand the humidity & moisture that goes with being in a females' life. Just an idea.
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post #12 of 20 Old 07-05-2014, 08:33 PM
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Mitre corners, glue. Then cut an 1/8 X 1/8 rabbit in some solid stock, then rip so that you have an L shape. Glue these up the outside corners, when dry, use a roundover bit to knock off the outside of the L. Pick either a contrasting or matching wood for the L shape.

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post #13 of 20 Old 07-06-2014, 01:05 AM Thread Starter
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I decided to go with 1/4" instead of 1/8" for more structural stability. I think I may use this as a learning moment to try and dovetail. Gotta learn sometime and if that doesn't workout just miter and tack.

I bookmarked the link of the box with the inner liner. I like that and have added that to my project to do list.

Thanks for the help/suggestions. Will post back how things went
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post #14 of 20 Old 07-06-2014, 03:54 AM
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Dovetails are a fantastic joint. If you really want it to pop, and get some Brownie points from the SO, try using contrasting woods. Something like birch for the sides and walnut for the top and bottom
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post #15 of 20 Old 07-09-2014, 05:42 PM
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I'm a bit late to the party but you might want to consider bentwood boxes. The NW Indians made some pretty amazing boxes out of thin cedar. I've always wanted to try that.


Steaming would allow you make some pretty cool shapes. The shakers traditionally made round boxes.

They are pretty easy to do and look quite nice. My dad used to turn them out by the dozens and gave them out as gifts.
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post #16 of 20 Old 07-09-2014, 07:29 PM
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ugh. double post. not sure how that happened an hour+ later...

Last edited by PhilBa; 07-09-2014 at 07:31 PM. Reason: double post
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post #17 of 20 Old 07-09-2014, 08:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hokeyplyr48
Thanks for the suggestions. The box is going to be used for my wife to store makeup brushes so low stress. I may just try mitering the corners and tacking then putting glue on the joint and hope for the best. It shouldn't be subject to extreme stresses. If it does break then I can try the square dowel in each corner to add glueing surface area. Thanks for the tip.
I would miter the corners and put a dado on the bottom to receive the bottom board. No brads. Dry fit everything by using masking tape.

It would look nice if the top edge had a small round over on the inside and nothing on the outside just break the corners on the out side.

I would also only use masking tape for glue up. Plenty of pressure for this box. Too much can give you problems. It will be stronger if you can run the grain horizontal. Vertical my push it off the base.

Al


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post #18 of 20 Old 07-09-2014, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Neul
With 1/8" thick material no joint is going to be great. I would just miter it and just glue the joint without fasteners. If you could put some kind of corner blocks on the inside it would help a lot.
I agree. But I don't like the corner blocks. How about half blocks cut on the angle. Triangle blocks and leave them down an inch.

Al


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post #19 of 20 Old 07-10-2014, 03:24 PM
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I am glad to hear you decided to go with 1/4" thickness. It will make a big difference no matter what joints you decide to do.
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post #20 of 20 Old 07-10-2014, 03:48 PM Thread Starter
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lots of good ideas. I definitely will do the inside chamfer/rounding of the edges to give it a nicer touch and ease the edges.

Also, I may try making a box with the 1/2 corner blocks cut on the angle and inch from the top.

At this point, every box may be different as I try different methods lol
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