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post #1 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 10:44 PM Thread Starter
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Joining without fasteners.

Hello, I'm quite new to woodworking, (just bought roundover bits for my router today and tried those out)

I'm currently embarking on a new project of building a new headshell for my guitar amplifier out of flamed maple 25x10x9.5. I'd like to join in such a way that there is NO fasteners, at least visible, how would i do this with limited knowledge and tools?

The only idea i had was glue blocks but i'd rather not have anything that may get in the way of components. thanks.!
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post #2 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 10:52 PM
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Pocket screws on the inside. Biscuits in the joint, dowels, dovetails and glue on all of them.

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
Finishing is 3 parts chemistry and 1 part VooDoo http://lrgwood.com
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post #3 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 10:54 PM Thread Starter
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Pocket screws on the inside. Biscuits in the joint, dowels, dovetails and glue on all of them.
Okay, what are "pocket screws" Also, I'm not even sure if i could do biscuits or dovetails, i did watch a video on how to do dovetails with a router but i don't know if its worth purchasing a router table for one project.
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post #4 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 11:20 PM
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Quote:
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Pocket screws on the inside. Biscuits in the joint, dowels, dovetails and glue on all of them.
We shouldn't forget splines, M&T, and tenons to include loose ones.





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post #5 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 11:21 PM
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Look up Kreg Pocket Hole jig. Got to youtube and look. It's a great system, not that expensive if you get the two holer, drill and clamp. Won't do miters though, just butt joints.

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
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post #6 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 11:29 PM Thread Starter
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Look up Kreg Pocket Hole jig. Got to youtube and look. It's a great system, not that expensive if you get the two holer, drill and clamp. Won't do miters though, just butt joints.
Thanks so much! I've been looking forward to this project for a LONG time, and I want to try and make it as perfect as possible (not to mention the board itself was $100) and the Kreg seems like it will fit the bill VERY nicely. From some reading i can just plug the holes with dowels and it will be even less noticeable.

Now i just have to work on getting my router skills a little better, keep messing up corners!
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post #7 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 11:36 PM
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Put the holes on the inside and you won't have to do anything to them.

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
Finishing is 3 parts chemistry and 1 part VooDoo http://lrgwood.com
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post #8 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 11:38 PM Thread Starter
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One more quick question, I plan on rounding over the edges with a router, would i run into problems with the screws if i was to do that?
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post #9 of 56 Old 07-21-2012, 11:46 PM
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Depends on how big the roundover is and how thick the wood is. You can use a 1" screw instead of the 1 1/4", that will give you a bit more roundover ability.

Do a test, use glue and some screws. After the glue dries remove the screws and do the roundover. If you don't see any screw holes peeking through then you know you are good to go.

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
Finishing is 3 parts chemistry and 1 part VooDoo http://lrgwood.com
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post #10 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 12:00 AM
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domino's.....
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post #11 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lateralus819 View Post
Hello, I'm quite new to woodworking, (just bought roundover bits for my router today and tried those out)

I'm currently embarking on a new project of building a new headshell for my guitar amplifier out of flamed maple 25x10x9.5. I'd like to join in such a way that there is NO fasteners, at least visible, how would i do this with limited knowledge and tools?

The only idea i had was glue blocks but i'd rather not have anything that may get in the way of components. thanks.!
Just use plain old, ordinary, Tight Bond (or your favorite brand) glue.

I think that the use of fasteners is relatively new to the world of wood working. For centuries the primary way that wood work has been held together is glue.

George
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post #12 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 08:57 AM
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+1 with George. I try to use glued joints where possible.

I use fasteners when I need to be able to dis-assemble the piece.
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post #13 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 10:51 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the kind suggestions guys i REALLY appreciate it, i'm a noob at woodworking.

I'd love to just do a glue joint but I'll be making a rectangular box and it will be joined end grain to long grain, how strong would that end up being?

The unit that will reside inside is roughly 40 to 45 lbs and I'm worried about it falling apart if i need to move it.
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post #14 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 10:54 AM
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A lot stronger than you think if you use epoxy or titebond. But you are correct that in edge to end you should have some sort of fastener. If you have a tablesaw then a spline is probably the easiest to make without getting special equipment.

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
Finishing is 3 parts chemistry and 1 part VooDoo http://lrgwood.com
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post #15 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 11:01 AM Thread Starter
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A lot stronger than you think if you use epoxy or titebond. But you are correct that in edge to end you should have some sort of fastener. If you have a tablesaw then a spline is probably the easiest to make without getting special equipment.
I have access to a table saw out work, how do i do a spline?
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post #16 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 11:08 AM
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I am having a hard time picturing a rectangular box which has end-grain to end-grain joint.

I can picture end-grain to face grain.

Any pictures?

A spline is merely a strip of wood which goes into a groove.

Make the groove whatever depth and thickness then cut a strip of wood to fit the groove dimensions.

If this is really just a butt jointed box, with end-grain against face grain, another option may be dowels.

How thick is the wood?
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post #17 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 11:11 AM Thread Starter
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I am having a hard time picturing a rectangular box which has end-grain to end-grain joint.

I can picture end-grain to face grain.

Any pictures?

A spline is merely a strip of wood which goes into a groove.

Make the groove whatever depth and thickness then cut a strip of wood to fit the groove dimensions.

If this is really just a butt jointed box, with end-grain against face grain, another option may be dowels.

How thick is the wood?
check out this thread my friend.

http://www.robchapman.tv/forum/threa...hoto-fest.561/

Basically the same thing is what i am going to make. He used dove tail but i dont have access to a machine or the knowledge. The wood is 3/4 thick.

hope this helps.
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post #18 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 11:14 AM
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You can do one of two things. Make a tongue and groove joint which is the more difficult of the two. Lets say you are using 3/4" stock. You would take one of your boards and using the tablesaw make a groove in the board so the backside of the kerf is 3/4" from the front edge of the board. Normally the groove would be just over 1/4". Then you would cut a rabbet in the other board that will mate so it leaves a tongue that is 1/4". When you fit them together it forces the boards to line up flush with each other, assuming you did everything correctly.

The other way is to make a groove in each board. You would set the groove up in or near the middle of the thickness of the board so if you are using a 1/8" blade you would have a 5/16" space between the fence and the blade. Then you would take one of the boards and lay it down on the tablesaw and push it through the blade. Then you would take the other board and hold it up against the fence (vertically) and push it through the blade. Now you have a groove near the edge on the face of one board and a groove on the edge of the other board. You now need to make the spline. It is just a 1/8" thick stripe of wood that fits into the two grooves, you could call it a "loose tongue" or a "loose tenon" Just make sure they fit snug and fill up both grooves. You could also make it 1/4" wide or whatever you need.

It is also best to make the grain in the direction that will give it the most strength. In this case the grain would go with the short length. A lot of people use 1/4" plywood for the splines.

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
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post #19 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 11:18 AM Thread Starter
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You can do one of two things. Make a tongue and groove joint which is the more difficult of the two. Lets say you are using 3/4" stock. You would take one of your boards and using the tablesaw make a groove in the board so the backside of the kerf is 3/4" from the front edge of the board. Normally the groove would be just over 1/4". Then you would cut a rabbet in the other board that will mate so it leaves a tongue that is 1/4". When you fit them together it forces the boards to line up flush with each other, assuming you did everything correctly.

The other way is to make a groove in each board. You would set the groove up in or near the middle of the thickness of the board so if you are using a 1/8" blade you would have a 5/16" space between the fence and the blade. Then you would take one of the boards and lay it down on the tablesaw and push it through the blade. Then you would take the other board and hold it up against the fence (vertically) and push it through the blade. Now you have a groove near the edge on the face of one board and a groove on the edge of the other board. You now need to make the spline. It is just a 1/8" thick stripe of wood that fits into the two grooves, you could call it a "loose tongue" or a "loose tenon" Just make sure they fit snug and fill up both grooves. You could also make it 1/4" wide or whatever you need.

It is also best to make the grain in the direction that will give it the most strength. In this case the grain would go with the short length. A lot of people use 1/4" plywood for the splines.

The 2nd option is more akin to a biscuit joint correct?
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post #20 of 56 Old 07-22-2012, 11:22 AM
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Yes. But a biscuit jointer (plate jointer) is anywhere between $60 and $600 depending on what brand you get (Ryobi - Lamelo). You have a tablesaw and this option is free for you right now and the jointery has been used for centuries. If I had to choose between the Pocket Hole jig and the biscuit jointer I'd take the PH jig in a heartbeat. So much more useful.

Of course, I have both.

and then some

Measure Twice Cut Once -- It's a lot easier to cut more off then it is to cut MORON.
Finishing is 3 parts chemistry and 1 part VooDoo http://lrgwood.com
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