How should I cut this box joint? - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
 14Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 12:23 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
How should I cut this box joint?

I'm getting ready to start on a 4'x2' chest that I'd like to use a box joint for the corners. I have done a few box joints, all on a jig for the table saw, but they were on much shorter pieces that 2', let alone 4'. I'm not sure how hard it will be to cut box joints in a 4'x 2' panel on a table saw. I thought about a router, but not sure about what kind of jig I would need.

If you were to cut joints for a box similar to this, how would you do it?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	product_p_i_pid_12532-amish-furniture-bedroom-furniture-oak-wood-kingston-with-shaker-base-deep-.jpg
Views:	127
Size:	55.4 KB
ID:	358578  

Ron_J is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 12:59 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 834
View Terry Q's Photo Album My Photos
You just want box joints at the corners, not on the bottom. If you use box joints on the corners as shown in the photo, you wont have problems with wood movement, the box will grow and shrink in height with no problems. If you try to attach the bottom with box joints the board will be constrained by the sides and you will eventually blow out the bottom corners. Best to use a different method to attach the bottom.

As for bigger boards, 2 foot box joints arent any different then smaller boxes if you can cut them accurately. Basically, you are just scaling up the project. Id use 1/2 inch or bigger box joints to make it easier.


In woodworking there is always more then one way to accomplish something.
Terry Q is offline  
post #3 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 02:22 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Garland, TX
Posts: 4,232
View Toolman50's Photo Album My Photos
I agree with you that trying to cut a box joint on pieces that big on the tablesaw will be difficult.
I think I would use the router.
You will need t make a jig because a dovetail jig wont be long enough.
You might try to make a jig attached to your hand-held router that will index, using the last cut made for correct spacing.
Others may have ideas theyve used successfully.
Ron_J likes this.

If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when will you have time to do it over?
Toolman50 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 02:28 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toolman50 View Post
I agree with you that trying to cut a box joint on pieces that big on the tablesaw will be difficult.
I think I would use the router.
You will need t make a jig because a dovetail jig wont be long enough.
You might try to make a jig attached to your hand-held router that will index, using the last cut made for correct spacing.
Others may have ideas theyve used successfully.
This is what I was thinking, but a little unsure how to tackle it.
Ron_J is offline  
post #5 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 02:31 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Q View Post
You just want box joints at the corners, not on the bottom. If you use box joints on the corners as shown in the photo, you wont have problems with wood movement, the box will grow and shrink in height with no problems. If you try to attach the bottom with box joints the board will be constrained by the sides and you will eventually blow out the bottom corners. Best to use a different method to attach the bottom.

As for bigger boards, 2 foot box joints arent any different then smaller boxes if you can cut them accurately. Basically, you are just scaling up the project. Id use 1/2 inch or bigger box joints to make it easier.


In woodworking there is always more then one way to accomplish something.
I' was thinking about 3/4" joints, to match the thickness of the panels. My concern is the 4' board sticking up in the air as I try to run it thru the table saw.

I think I am going to have the bottom float in a groove in the sides.
Ron_J is offline  
post #6 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 04:56 PM
Senior Member
 
mjadams61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Rockwall Texas
Posts: 389
View mjadams61's Photo Album My Photos
I am not sure if this would help you but part of my DIY router table is going to be where I can do this. But all depends on what size table saw a full shop one or jobsite one but maybe you can adapt this box joint jig to work for you and a dado blade since your tablesaw has dual tracks already and you beable to make the jig large enough to clamp and support your large pieces.

KevinM likes this.

Marlin
mjadams61 is offline  
post #7 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 05:23 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: On the farm in West Texas cotton country
Posts: 640
View WesTex's Photo Album My Photos
I would just lay out my cuts with a sharp pencil and then cut the joints with my dovetail saw.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
WesTex is online now  
post #8 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 08:01 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 26,067
View Steve Neul's Photo Album My Photos
If it were me I would do it on a table saw. Use a miter gauge with a board screwed to it and put a pin on the board the width of the blade from the blade. From there you just put the wood against the pin and make your first cut with the part on it's end and then lift it over the pin and set the first dado on the pin and just keep going until you reach the end. Then the opposing part you make the first cut flush with the end and then use the same miter gauge with the same pin.
Ron_J likes this.
Steve Neul is online now  
post #9 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 10:04 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 834
View Terry Q's Photo Album My Photos
On end with four feet sticking up is going to be hard regardless of whether you use a tablesaw or router table.

Ive never done box joints on anything that wide, but if I was going to try I think I would try doing it on my table saw for the following reasons:

1) Taking 3/4 deep by 3/4 wide box joints is going to be really tough on your router bit. Generally, taking more then 1/8 -1/4 inch per pass is all thats suggested.

2) I think you will need to use a sled that you can attach your board to so it wont move when cutting it. To improve the chance of success, Id try to use both miter tracks that are found on table saws. Router tables rarely have more then one.

3) using a dado blade will allow for very precise adjustments to width of cut to make slight adjustments to your fit. Router bits make fixed size cuts.

There are many videos showing the process of cutting and spacing for the next cut, Id look for ideas that help dealing with large pieces of wood. Like I say, a sled with solid right angle support tall enough to clamp your board. It might be a pain, clamping and unclamping every cut, but maybe you wont have too, but if you need to the option exists.

Id also like to suggest that you cut both long pieces at the same time, saving time and clamping. It also assures that if you screw it up, you can just make your box a little smaller by cutting off the end and starting over. Actually, you should probably cut the first end on oversized boards just to test the fit with actual material. You can resize after first end is successfully cut.


In woodworking there is always more then one way to accomplish something.
Ron_J and Tool Agnostic like this.
Terry Q is offline  
post #10 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 10:29 PM
where's my table saw?
 
woodnthings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: SE, Michigan
Posts: 27,614
View woodnthings's Photo Album My Photos
here's a tip ... untried however

I would use the table saw with the box jig, to make a pattern for the hand held router. I can't see standing a board of that length vertically on either the table saw or the router table, hence the hand held router. The pattern would be 24" long by about 3" wide and 3/4" thick. You would use a top mounted bearing bit in the notches so you don't tear it up. You would probably have to make several passes at increasing depths for a 3/4" notch.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
woodnthings is offline  
post #11 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 11:02 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Garland, TX
Posts: 4,232
View Toolman50's Photo Album My Photos
After thinking about this project some more, I think the best approach will be to make a sled with a tall back fence. Set you jig up on the sled and use the table saw with a dado blade. This sled will probably be used for this project only and can be made of plywood or MDF.
The pieces can be clamped to the fence for each cut for accuracy.
Ron_J, gj13us and Tool Agnostic like this.

If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when will you have time to do it over?
Toolman50 is offline  
post #12 of 24 Old 05-03-2018, 11:31 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: NE
Posts: 231
View Larry42's Photo Album My Photos
I would do similarly to what Terry suggested. Make your sled heavy and tall enough to support the parts well. Put some sort of clamping device on the sled to hold the parts against the fence during the cut. This assumes you have a decent table saw.
Tool Agnostic likes this.
Larry42 is offline  
post #13 of 24 Old 05-04-2018, 12:41 AM
Senior Member
 
Jig_saw's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 861
View Jig_saw's Photo Album My Photos
It looks like dovetail joints to me in that picture. I would cut it simply & easily with a dovetail saw, in the same time as it would require one to set up a cutting jig on a table saw or a router table. Here is a good video on cutting dovetail joint by hand:


Keep thy axe sharp.

Last edited by Jig_saw; 05-04-2018 at 12:43 AM.
Jig_saw is offline  
post #14 of 24 Old 05-04-2018, 06:05 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Neul View Post
If it were me I would do it on a table saw. Use a miter gauge with a board screwed to it and put a pin on the board the width of the blade from the blade. From there you just put the wood against the pin and make your first cut with the part on it's end and then lift it over the pin and set the first dado on the pin and just keep going until you reach the end. Then the opposing part you make the first cut flush with the end and then use the same miter gauge with the same pin.
This is how I have done it in the past with good results. Like I said, just a little apprehensive about doing it with a 4' board.
Ron_J is offline  
post #15 of 24 Old 05-04-2018, 06:08 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toolman50 View Post
After thinking about this project some more, I think the best approach will be to make a sled with a tall back fence. Set you jig up on the sled and use the table saw with a dado blade. This sled will probably be used for this project only and can be made of plywood or MDF.
The pieces can be clamped to the fence for each cut for accuracy.
I think this is going to be my approach. My TS sled is only 6" tall, but I can replace the back fence with a taller fence easily enough.
Ron_J is offline  
post #16 of 24 Old 05-04-2018, 06:10 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Q View Post
Id also like to suggest that you cut both long pieces at the same time, saving time and clamping. It also assures that if you screw it up, you can just make your box a little smaller by cutting off the end and starting over. Actually, you should probably cut the first end on oversized boards just to test the fit with actual material. You can resize after first end is successfully cut.
I like this idea.
Ron_J is offline  
post #17 of 24 Old 05-04-2018, 06:40 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 26,067
View Steve Neul's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron_J View Post
This is how I have done it in the past with good results. Like I said, just a little apprehensive about doing it with a 4' board.
Yes it's a bit cumbersome but doable. The board you put on the miter gauge could be ten to twelve inches wide and you could even put some brackets on the back side to keep it from bending.
Steve Neul is online now  
post #18 of 24 Old 05-04-2018, 08:20 AM
Senior Member
 
hawkeye10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Murfreesboro, Tn.
Posts: 1,197
View hawkeye10's Photo Album My Photos
Well Ron I also have an opinion. I have tried making box joints on a router table and the problem is tearout on the front side. Unless you put a board in front of your work piece you will have this problem.

Don in Murfreesboro, TN.
hawkeye10 is offline  
post #19 of 24 Old 06-25-2018, 07:19 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Ron_J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Central PA
Posts: 459
View Ron_J's Photo Album My Photos
Just thought I would update this, in case anyone is looking to do the same. It ended up not being as bad as I expected. I added an extra high backet to my miter and clamped the piece for every cut.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20180608_195451.jpg
Views:	50
Size:	365.6 KB
ID:	363116  

Click image for larger version

Name:	20180608_202233.jpg
Views:	59
Size:	378.0 KB
ID:	363118  

Click image for larger version

Name:	20180610_161026.jpg
Views:	49
Size:	422.3 KB
ID:	363120  

Ron_J is offline  
post #20 of 24 Old 07-05-2018, 02:34 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: NW Pa
Posts: 2,993
View TimPa's Photo Album My Photos
nicely done Ron!


I know where you could have got a leigh dovetail jig!! you did it a lot cheaper tho....




looking forward to the assembly pics!
Ron_J likes this.
TimPa is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Decorative joint for exterior pergola with pressure treated lumber borderguy Joinery 2 08-09-2017 04:21 PM
Oak table with table leg wedge joint and brass details Christian S General Woodworking Discussion 13 07-09-2017 03:58 PM
What is this simple joint called, and is it any good? ugcheleuce Joinery 8 03-04-2016 07:43 PM
Broken Finger joint/box joint issue? Woodworking Beginner Joinery 4 12-05-2015 08:09 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome