cutting accurate mitre joints. - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
 
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post #1 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 07:45 AM Thread Starter
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cutting accurate mitre joints.

Hello people,I am looking to make a hexagon utensil holder out of 9mm thick pieces of oak..What machine will be most appropriate to make accurate 60 degree rip cuts?

Thank you!
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post #2 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 08:32 AM
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What "machine" do you own? Or are you going to purchase what is recommended?

If it is a one time build and you do not own anything then good quality hand saw miter box.

George
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post #3 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 09:24 AM
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60 degrees is beyond the ripping capacity of table saws, which are commonly used for ripping. No big deal, we run into limitations all the time. For ripping, you place the work on edge and rip the complimentary angle of 60, 30 degrees. With a right tilt saw, you move the fence to the left of the blade, opposite for left tilt. Many will add a sacrificial fence to the saw fence.

Not sure why you want 60 for a hexagon, those would be 22.5 degree rips.
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post #4 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 09:36 AM
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If you have a router/table, Eagle America has router bits that are made especially for cutting multi-sided projects at 60/30 degree angles for 7/8 max stock thickness. Part # is 190-2865 and prices are about $40 USD & are USA made. Be safe.
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post #5 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer1 View Post
60 degrees is beyond the ripping capacity of table saws, which are commonly used for ripping. No big deal, we run into limitations all the time. For ripping, you place the work on edge and rip the complimentary angle of 60, 30 degrees. With a right tilt saw, you move the fence to the left of the blade, opposite for left tilt. Many will add a sacrificial fence to the saw fence.

Not sure why you want 60 for a hexagon, those would be 22.5 degree rips.
Don't you mean 30 degrees? 22.5 will give an octagon.

Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something -Plato

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post #6 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 03:20 PM
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I do not understand the use of the term "rip" when writing about cutting a miter joint. Will someone please explain?

George
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post #7 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by GeorgeC View Post
I do not understand the use of the term "rip" when writing about cutting a miter joint. Will someone please explain?

George
Think six sided box, at least that is what I read.

Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something -Plato

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post #8 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 04:43 PM
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OK, I was thinking in 2 dimensions. He is cutting boards of some width and length.

George
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post #9 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 05:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefan1000 View Post
Hello people,I am looking to make a hexagon utensil holder out of 9mm thick pieces of oak..What machine will be most appropriate to make accurate 60 degree rip cuts?

Thank you!
More info neded, you have some Oak about 3/8" thick, the miter angle you want for 6 sides is 30 degrees.
The width or box "height" will determine what size Miter saw you need.
"ripping" is confusing everyone, that's when you cut parallel to the grain.
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post #10 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankC View Post
Don't you mean 30 degrees? 22.5 will give an octagon.
Duh! My Latin must be slipping. Thanks for the correction.
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post #11 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by bzguy View Post
More info neded, you have some Oak about 3/8" thick, the miter angle you want for 6 sides is 30 degrees.
The width or box "height" will determine what size Miter saw you need.
"ripping" is confusing everyone, that's when you cut parallel to the grain.
I envisioned a tall tube for kitchen utensils, not very large around. Thinner strips could be ripped at the proper angle to make it. I think it's still a miter regardless of whether it's cross cut, bias cut or ripped along the grain. Some definitions only recognize a 90 degree corner for miter but direction isn't mentioned.
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post #12 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 10:36 PM
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Ah,
Now this is making sense, rip and all.
I have done this in various polygons, the trick to having them come out nicely is uniformity.
The wood is thin enough so that holding it down flat on a table saw set at 30 degrees should not be a problem.
Cut the six pieces without moving the fence on last cut.
Carefully lay them with the outside side up on a flat surface with the points of the mitered edges touching.
Take some wide masking tape and carefully tape across the pieces perpendicular top/middle/bottom, more if the length requires.
Leave some extra tape running past on one side.
You can then flip the pieces over, apply glue to inside of joints, the tape will act as hinges allowing you to "roll" it up into a "cylinder" and secure with the excess tape.
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post #13 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 10:40 PM
where's my table saw?
 
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he wants to "rip" them!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefan1000 View Post
Hello people,I am looking to make a hexagon utensil holder out of 9mm thick pieces of oak..What machine will be most appropriate to make accurate 60 degree rip cuts?

Thank you!
A rip at 60 degrees is called a bevel. He;s got the angle wrong, it will be 30 degrees on each piece for a total of 60 degrees at each intersection..... 360 divided by 6 (hexagon) is 60 per intersection.

This a a basic bevel cut using the fence on the table saw.
Ripping down the length of the workpiece is what would be required to make a tall hexagonal container.

Simple, unless I'm not understanding the original post.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #14 of 19 Old 09-27-2014, 10:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post
A rip at 60 degrees is called a bevel. He;s got the angle wrong, it will be 30 degrees on each piece for a total of 60 degrees at each intersection..... 360 divided by 6 (hexagon) is 60 per intersection.

This a a basic bevel cut using the fence on the table saw.
Ripping down the length of the workpiece is what would be required to make a tall hexagonal container.

Simple, unless I'm not understanding the original post.
You got me thinking now, I could be mistaken here but...
In Geometry class, (long ago!) I learned that each time you add a side to a polygon you add 180 degrees to the total.
A Triangle has three 60 degree corners, adding up to 180.
A square has four 90 degree corners, 360, and so on.
Following that rule, a 6 sided polygon should total 720.
720 divided by 6 is 120, so the miter angle should be half, 60.
A table saw is 90 when straight up, so 60 should work, 2/3rds of the way to the 45 they normally tilt.
When you picture a 6 sided tube, the intersections are obtuse angles, (more than 90) 120 degrees.
Love to know if this is correct, my shop here is in storage right now, cannot prove this to myself?

Last edited by bzguy; 09-27-2014 at 11:07 PM.
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post #15 of 19 Old 09-28-2014, 01:25 AM
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your are correct.

The internal angles of a hexagon ARE 120 degrees, my mistake.:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexagon
That means a 60 degree bevel on each edge. That also means you set the saw to 30 degrees from vertical, which is 90 degrees, to get the complementary angle.

Use a draftsman's triangle or a Wixey Digital box, or other means to get the angle spot on, and don't trust the scale on the saw. This reminds me of the discussion on the miter saw, where the settings on the saw are the complementary angle, not the labeled one.... except at 45 degrees. Same for the miter gauge, a 30 degree setting will give a 60 degree angle on the work:
http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f27/a...iter-saw-9644/

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #16 of 19 Old 09-28-2014, 04:19 PM Thread Starter
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Thank guys for some good advice!I have a jointer planer and thought of doing the cuts on this..my table saw has a fence that I need to sort out before I can make cuts in it.The jointer planer works(cuts is long grain cuts) but keeping the pieces against the fence while pushing the piece through has been tricky for me.Any ideas of how I can keep the piece against the fence with more control?..
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post #17 of 19 Old 09-28-2014, 07:10 PM
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Pushing the pieces through the jointer with the fence angles to 60 degrees shouldn't be difficult.
Just keep pressure against the fence and downward on OUT-FEED table.
What I would be concerned about is getting the piece to a uniform width.
Even if pre-sized on a table-saw wood tends to bow as tension is released by machining.
The jointer will remove more "meat" in high spots and you end up with non-uniform pieces.
Ideally you rip the pieces very close to finished size, straighten an edge on the jointer, run that side on the fence beveling the opposite, then rip the bevel on last side.
If you have a table saw the fence can be improvised with any straight-edge and clamps.

Last edited by bzguy; 09-28-2014 at 08:10 PM.
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post #18 of 19 Old 09-30-2014, 10:27 AM Thread Starter
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Guys thanks for advice on hexagon, came out perfect..now another question..I want to make a triangles from the same oak(9mm thick,sorry for mm I am not from america:),so basically three triangular pieces, the sides of the triangles will be 5 inches.So getting the 3 pieces to meet and form a three sided pyramid/prism I need 30 degree miter cuts on the edges of the triangles.I have seen people create a 45 degree angle fence for their miter saw but on something so small I am a bit worried...

Hope this make sense..

Thanks People!
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post #19 of 19 Old 09-30-2014, 11:19 AM
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You can also do this on table saw.
You should have zero clearance so that pieces do not fall into table saw slot.
Set saw angle at same 60 degrees, but this time the wood will be held perpendicular to table against the fence.
First take a large enough piece of 1/4" ply and clamp it above lowered blade.
Start saw and run blade up through plywood at 60 degrees.
Now you have a zero clearance top, clamp fence parallel to and so that it just misses blade to get a 30 degree "point" on the pieces.
Slide them through holding them up against the fence.
They should be straightened and sized the same way on jointer and saw first.
Like the jointer, keep downward pressure on pieces just beyond the blade so that you do not force pieces into slot and cause binding and irregularities in cuts.

Last edited by bzguy; 09-30-2014 at 11:29 AM.
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