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steve4king 03-30-2018 03:08 PM

Shaping large boards
 
1 Attachment(s)
I'm building a bed and considering adding a little more shape to my project than I'd originally planned.
I realize that I could do this with a ridiculous amount of sanding.. but imagine some of you probably know better ways to accomplish this, and probably far more accurate/consistent than sanding.

If I wanted to shape a 2"x8"x8' length of Red Oak, adding a convex curve along the top and concave (cove) down the length of the board.. Is there a better way than sanding (maybe in combination with a cove cut on a table saw for the bottom half, and a large roundover router bit for the top.) See the picture below in case my description is unclear.

Thanks!
-Stephen

Toolman50 03-30-2018 04:21 PM

Based on the design you show, I would start by cutting a cove on the table saw for the lower part.
The top is a thumb cut with a router or shaper.
Final finish can be done by making an inverse of the design to use as your sanding black. Lots of hand sanding starting wit 60 grit through 220grit to get a very smooth design.

Steve Neul 03-30-2018 06:04 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by steve4king (Post 1934817)
I'm building a bed and considering adding a little more shape to my project than I'd originally planned.
I realize that I could do this with a ridiculous amount of sanding.. but imagine some of you probably know better ways to accomplish this, and probably far more accurate/consistent than sanding.

If I wanted to shape a 2"x8"x8' length of Red Oak, adding a convex curve along the top and concave (cove) down the length of the board.. Is there a better way than sanding (maybe in combination with a cove cut on a table saw for the bottom half, and a large roundover router bit for the top.) See the picture below in case my description is unclear.

Thanks!
-Stephen

How much woodworking experience do you have? What I'm proposing is dangerous for the novice. The concave part of the rail could be made by setting up a wooden fence on a table saw and run the wood across the blade on an angle.

Terry Q 03-30-2018 08:41 PM

Shaping large boards
 
It can be challenging feeding long and wide boards flat on a tablesaw, router or shaper with out a power feeder. The very best way to do this is to pay some who has a molder. Perhaps you could give an idea of where you live, someone nearby might be able to help. Might cost up to $200 to get custom knives made, but it will do a much better job.


In woodworking there is always more then one way to accomplish something.

Jay C. White Cloud 03-30-2018 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve4king (Post 1934817)
I'm building a bed and considering adding a little more shape to my project than I'd originally planned.
I realize that I could do this with a ridiculous amount of sanding.. but imagine some of you probably know better ways to accomplish this, and probably far more accurate/consistent than sanding.

If I wanted to shape a 2"x8"x8' length of Red Oak, adding a convex curve along the top and concave (cove) down the length of the board.. Is there a better way than sanding (maybe in combination with a cove cut on a table saw for the bottom half, and a large roundover router bit for the top.) See the picture below in case my description is unclear.

Thanks!
-Stephen

Hi Stephen,

Even as a professional woodworker, if I didn't have a large production run of something like you are suggesting. I would save it for a Friday's work schedule and do it all by hand with plane, scraper, draw knife, gouge and/or a combination there of.

Its pleasing work, and much faster than most would think...My go to is almost always the gouge, being perhaps the fastest of non-powered tools...

Surface gouge work

pro70z28 03-30-2018 10:56 PM

I would generate a 2 rail sweep, 3d file and run it on the CNC with a 1/2" bull nose cutter.

woodnthings 03-31-2018 12:33 AM

There you have it .....
 
Everything from a CNC, hand gouges, table saw and a molder.
Here's what I would use if I owned one:

There are quite a few of these out there, and I wouldn't be surprised if you searched or ran a want ad for custom moldings or millwork you will find someone who could help you. That's if the other approaches fail .... table saw round over bits and such.

Here's the one I do have, but I've never used the molder aspect of it:

woodnthings 03-31-2018 07:44 PM

Another approach
 
I remembered this old boy who impressed me with his use of the RAS to make moldings. There will be a hue and cry as he says when anyone uses a RAS to do anything because they are "inherently unsafe" according to "expert" You Tube viewers..... :wink:


Brian T 02-19-2019 11:24 PM

How about a wood carving method? Less than $50,000.



I will use a 3/4" bit in my oldfashioned straight router.
I will plow a bunch of tracks, nearly side by side at calculated depths, to hog out the waste.
Then I will bash out the ribs with a mallet and gouge, maybe a 5/35. The ribs were essential to support the router.

The fun part is to clean it all up with an "Inshave".

Like a spokeshave but it's curved for carving the hollow part of a wooden chair seat.
Maybe a bunch of sanding.

I'd prefer the cutting action of cabinet scrapers (DIY) to the shreddy mess of papers if you need smoothness.

woodnthings 02-20-2019 07:44 AM

here we go again .....
 
This thread was started in March of 2018 and brought back to life yesterday. If the OP has not returned since March of 2018, chances are he's either passed on or passed by. For a limited run of 8 ft, the minimum tooling cost suggestions are the most reasonable, that includes the cove cut on the tablesaw, the router adjusted to various depths since you will need it to round over the ends regardless. Hand tool approaches may require some specialty tools like a scorp or roughing blade in your hand plane.


The advice should always fit the application realistically cost wise, so a 50K to 100K CNC is not gonna "cut it"..... :vs_cool:

gmercer_48083 02-20-2019 01:31 PM

I would use a cove cut on a tablesaw using a flat bottom ripping blade to get a smooth finish, then finish the rest with a #4 hand plane.

Brian T 02-20-2019 03:57 PM

Some old threads are still juicy ones. Always something to learn.



Missed my chance = Lee Valley used to stock an "Inshave". No longer.
Should have bought one just for the hell of it.


In that case, risky as it is, I'll go with the bias cut on the table saw.
Maybe, just, maybe, do the router treatment first to reduce the load on the saw blade.

gmercer_48083 02-20-2019 07:16 PM

Brian T, The bias cut on the table saw is done 1/8" at a pass, and if you use a flat top rip blade it comes out pretty smooth, and safe if you capture the piece using a guide on each side of your molding. Your table saw blade has more cutters yet works as a router.

Brian T 02-20-2019 09:37 PM

Is that guaranteed to improve the quality of my sleep?
Not.
An extra blanket is VERY cost-effective.



My table saw bucks so bad at the start that it can unlock the fence.
You guys make this. I'll watch.

woodnthings 02-20-2019 10:50 PM

A bucking table saw... WOW!
 
You either have a lousy table saw OR a lousy fence... maybe both?
I have a few, I can probably spare one for Ya? :vs_cool:

gmercer_48083 02-21-2019 01:02 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by gmercer_48083 (Post 2039523)
Brian T, The bias cut on the table saw is done 1/8" at a pass, and if you use a flat top rip blade it comes out pretty smooth, and safe if you capture the piece using a guide on each side of your molding. Your table saw blade has more cutters yet works as a router.



Upon thinking about this statement I would like to revise. I used sketchup to see how the radius would conform by using this method. As it turns out, in order to hollow it to a depth of 3/4" you would have to run the board at 90 degrees to the blade and I advise against doing this for two reasons.

#1, when going over the blade at an angle beyond 45 degrees would invite kickback. I would recommend an angle of less than 30 degrees from being parallel to the blade.


#2. when shearing the grain at an angle of more than 30 degrees you would get more tear out and would require a lot more cleanup.


I could be done in stages of a lesser angle by making two or more coves in order to rough hollow the shape...But the hollowing must be sheared away using the down cut portion of the blade when doing this, and removing less than 1/8" per pass.

woodnthings 02-21-2019 01:29 PM

The You Video I posted is relevant ......
 
The old boy who uses the RAS to make several of the cuts/profiles to create a similar shape molding demonstrates how setting the blade at an angle relarive to the feed direction will create a shallow cove in the material. The RAS just works from the top down rather than from the bottom up like the table saw. However, there are more dangers involved when the exposed blade is spinning above the work. He uses a combonation of the standard saw blade and a molding cutter head, Sear/Craftsman brand in the video. He is quite accomplished in the operation and set up of his machines:
https://youtu.be/JRviFZLXBi8?t=37


https://youtu.be/JRviFZLXBi8?t=806

Brian T 02-21-2019 04:16 PM

Buy the flat bed boards. Buy several profiles of attractive molding.

Glue them together and paint. We're done with this.


I paid a whopping $100.00 for a brand new 10" Ryobi table saw at Home Depot.

It gets used 1-2 times per year, if that. Came with a 40T t/c blade.
The fence might need a little adjustment, one of these years.
In the mean time, I'm the winner. I carve, don't power saw much.

GeorgeC 02-22-2019 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pro70z28 (Post 1935129)
I would generate a 2 rail sweep, 3d file and run it on the CNC with a 1/2" bull nose cutter.


Please translate that post into English. I have no idea what it is that you wrote.


George

Steve Neul 02-22-2019 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgeC (Post 2039825)
Please translate that post into English. I have no idea what it is that you wrote.


George

I think you would have to be trained in the operation of a CNC before it would make any sense.


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