Workbench project - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 64 Old 04-15-2013, 11:56 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
Workbench project

Hey fellas, just wanted to post my attempt at a hybrid holzepffel design workbench.

I will continue to add pics, but it is worthy to note that I am hand chopping each mortise, hand sawing each tenon, and hand planing the surface.

I hate Douglas fir, but its cheaper, and strong. The chipping and plane tear out is unavoidable, but its still fun. The markings on the top are isolating gaps that need attention. I am planing each side and dry fitting to avoid gaps. So far, it is slowly but surely getting there. The issue lies in how much to take off in each area to close the gaps. If I can get a perfectly book matched dry fit, the glue up will be easy, and the top will be ready to surface.

I plan on planing the surface after glue up, but am unsure at this time. Advice is needed and appreciated!
Attached Images
    
Sarge240 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 64 Old 04-15-2013, 05:55 PM
Senior Member
 
Dave Paine's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 7,222
View Dave Paine's Photo Album My Photos
I know when you say plane, you mean with a hand plane. Remind me what hand planes you have available?

If you have the equivalent of a No. 4 or No. 5 you may was to plane sub-assemblies of e.g., 2 pieces, then glue the sub-assemblies together.

I am happy to lend you a No. 6 or No. 7. Just need to mail back when you have finished. Either will fit in a 23 11/16in x 11 3/4in x 3in Large Flat Rate Priority Mail box. A large flat rate box is only about $16.
Dave Paine is offline  
post #3 of 64 Old 04-15-2013, 11:00 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
Well, I have extremely limited knowledge of hand planes, but started with a number 3 scrub plane. It's a cheap plane and chattered like crazy. I sharpened the blade, flattened the sole, and still it's terrible.

I just recently got a 1917 union number 5 from my wife's grandfather. It works like a charm, but I think it may not be big enough for the job. I would have bought a nice used bailey number 4 from here, but I needed to use my budget to buy the stock for the bench.

I plan on investing in a smoothing plane and a jointer plane at the very least, but that won't come until my reenlistment bonus comes. If you have one I can borrow, I would greatly appreciate it.

These are my current planes:

Cheap number 3
Union number 5
Stanley block plane (newer and not adjustable)
Union 1917 block plane

I also need to buy a mortise chisel next payday! These cheap lowes chisels are breaking on the edge one by one.

I can get a Narex mortise chisel from lee valley for $14.00
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image-211466883.jpg
Views:	333
Size:	101.5 KB
ID:	68461  

Click image for larger version

Name:	image-4183869109.jpg
Views:	285
Size:	95.9 KB
ID:	68462  

Click image for larger version

Name:	image-614686506.jpg
Views:	253
Size:	101.3 KB
ID:	68464  

Attached Images
 
Sarge240 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 64 Old 04-15-2013, 11:16 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,874
View trc65's Photo Album My Photos
You could probably get the job done with your #5, but it would be a lot easier if you borrowed a jointer from Dave.

I bought a couple of Narex's mortise chisels about 6 months ago and really like them - best buy for the $$ IMO.

"Good Behavior is the last refuge of mediocrity" -- Henry S. Haskins
trc65 is offline  
post #5 of 64 Old 04-15-2013, 11:37 PM
Senior Member
 
BernieL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Greenville NH
Posts: 1,399
View BernieL's Photo Album My Photos
I know you're a "neanderthal" woodworker (hand tools and no power) and I can respect that. But can you consider covering your bench with a laminate or other man made flat surface? Lots of choices out there and if you ruin the top after 10 years, unscrew it and replace it.

Its' never hot or cold in New Hampshire... its' always seasonal.
BernieL is offline  
post #6 of 64 Old 04-16-2013, 12:30 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
The Narex chisels are $30.00 less than the Veritas brand, and the reviews are really good.

There is a story behind my choice of hand tools over power. Basically it stems from my wife's grandfather, who built his house, his barn, his rifle rack, furniture, and woodshop all from hand tools. He has since given them away in favor of power tools, since he is older and lacks the strength and endurance to slam mallets and hammers like he was once able to do.

I was always fascinated by the idea of historical woodworking, where the technology of the day was in maneuvering a chisel, and the pressure of your body weight determined how the piece came out after sawing it. I watch Paul Sellers and Roy Underhill videos, and am just amazed at the level of skill and finesse these guys have with each piece they create. Paul Sellers used a #4 plane to create a raised panel out of flat stock. It was the only tool he used. To me, it is beautiful hand made craftsmanship. Power tools do the trick, and they dont take away from the handmade idea, nor the craftsmanship, but I prefer the older way of doing it.

I recently acquired a free tablesaw, and upon its third use, cutting a sheet of oak plywood, the blade binded and the piece kicked back and flew across the room, missing my abdomen by a mere inch or so.

I own a Router, as well as a Miter Saw, and use them often, but i feel that setting up jigs, and clamping down a workpiece in order to use the power tool is a lot of work when i can just go to town with a chisel and mallet, or a plane and spokeshave.

Just my opinion, and hope I didnt offend anyone.

As far as the bench top; well thats the entire reason for using the Holzeppfel inspired bench. These guys did everything by hand, and used a bench like this to accomplish it. I want a piece of history replicated into my own style, in order to work hand tools daily. Any other type of MDF or Plywood topped bench will suffice for the power tool woodworker, but i prefer the idea of doing it by hand, on a bench that was made for that type of work.

Again, i do not mean to offend, I am merely suggesting that my own personal preference is in doing it by hand.
Sarge240 is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Sarge240 For This Useful Post:
srestrepo (04-18-2013), trc65 (04-16-2013)
post #7 of 64 Old 04-16-2013, 11:15 PM
Senior Member
 
BernieL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Greenville NH
Posts: 1,399
View BernieL's Photo Album My Photos
One thing I always say about us woodworkers is that we can all do something in a different way and all get the same result. No need to apologize here Sarge. I don't mean to bother you and maybe you've already seen my bench post but I'd like to point it out to you because it is ideal for hand tools. The fence can be 1/4" thick so your hand planes can shoot right of the workpiece without bumping the fence. It has quite a mixture of add on devises and maybe you can incorporate one into your bench... anyways... here it is

http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f2/ve...-unique-40361/

Keep us posted on your bench

Its' never hot or cold in New Hampshire... its' always seasonal.
BernieL is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to BernieL For This Useful Post:
trc65 (04-16-2013)
post #8 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 01:20 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
I finished the saddle joint for two legs, as well as the through mortise for the end stretchers.

One set ready for width dry fit. I shooting for exactly 32 inches width, which is enough for me to reach across without lying across the bench top.

Hand chopping the mortise holes in DF is not easy. The side walls of the mortise continue to splinter badly. I can't seem to angle the chisel enough to slice it sideways, so I am forced to chisel downward. The end grain chips out, so I angle the bevel into the wall and it cuts it relatively straight. Corners of the mortise walls are splintered and difficult to slice or chop.

I might invest in a goose neck chisel from Lee Valley. It might make a difference.

I'll post pics soon
Sarge240 is offline  
post #9 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 03:26 AM
master sawdust maker
 
Wema826's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Brush Creek tn (1 hour east of Nashville
Posts: 437
View Wema826's Photo Album My Photos
Instead of chopping all the mortises by chisel. have you considered using a brace and bit? It is still in the tradition of all hand work but it would be easier then chopping and quicker too. I can send ya a brace if you need one. I have several that are wall hangers. just pick up some augers that are the right size for ya. shoot me a PM with your address if you want a brace. Ill ship one to ya and you can add it to your collection!

John,

Confidence does not come from always being right. It comes from not being afraid to be wrong.
Wema826 is offline  
post #10 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 11:01 AM
Member
 
srestrepo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 60
View srestrepo's Photo Album My Photos
liek bernieL says, we can all get teh same end result in any combination of ways. i like the way this is being done. being new to woodworking i liek to see things done in as many ways as possible. i feel it opens my eyes to all of the different techniques that exist. so far, i've been a smidge too scared to do any traditional joinery liek mortise and tenon but this looks pretty cool and i might have to give it a try. keep us updated, i'd like to see your take on the holzeppfel.
srestrepo is offline  
post #11 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 01:35 PM
Master firewood maker
 
Chris Curl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,973
View Chris Curl's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarge240 View Post
...
I was always fascinated by the idea of historical woodworking, where the technology of the day was in maneuvering a chisel, and the pressure of your body weight determined how the piece came out after sawing it. I watch Paul Sellers and Roy Underhill videos, and am just amazed at the level of skill and finesse these guys have with each piece they create. Paul Sellers used a #4 plane to create a raised panel out of flat stock. It was the only tool he used. To me, it is beautiful hand made craftsmanship. Power tools do the trick, and they dont take away from the handmade idea, nor the craftsmanship, but I prefer the older way of doing it.

I recently acquired a free tablesaw, and upon its third use, cutting a sheet of oak plywood, the blade binded and the piece kicked back and flew across the room, missing my abdomen by a mere inch or so.

I own a Router, as well as a Miter Saw, and use them often, but i feel that setting up jigs, and clamping down a workpiece in order to use the power tool is a lot of work when i can just go to town with a chisel and mallet, or a plane and spokeshave.

...

Again, i do not mean to offend, I am merely suggesting that my own personal preference is in doing it by hand.
My feelings exactly! For me, the idea of needing eye, lung and ear protection to cut a piece of wood really takes away the therapeutic aspect of the hobby.

I recently finished my own version of the "new-fangled" workbench. It is primarily setup for hand work as well. The "new-fangled" part of it is that it uses 2 pairs of pipe clamps in a very flexible way for securing the work to the bench.

For what it's worth, i made it using hand tools for the most part. but i did use a drill press for the holes for the pipes.
Chris Curl is offline  
post #12 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 01:55 PM
Trytore Member
 
Shop Dad's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Central New Jersey
Posts: 2,764
View Shop Dad's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wema826 View Post
Instead of chopping all the mortises by chisel. have you considered using a brace and bit? It is still in the tradition of all hand work but it would be easier then chopping and quicker too. I can send ya a brace if you need one. I have several that are wall hangers. just pick up some augers that are the right size for ya. shoot me a PM with your address if you want a brace. Ill ship one to ya and you can add it to your collection!
Nice offers Wema and Dave. I was thinking the same thing about drilling out some of the mortises and a brace would be perfect in this case. As far as the chip out I know what you are experiencing. Best you can do is make sure your chisels are very sharp. How are you sharpening them?
Shop Dad is offline  
post #13 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 02:03 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
Yes, thanks so much guys.

I am sharpening each chisel with sandpaper and a file. The chisels are cheap, and are getting replaced soon as I can afford to get the Narex set from lee valley.

I plan on sanding each mortise wall down with 150 grit and then 220. That should make for an easier fit and smoother wall.

I also plan to use 5/8 oak dowels to secure the tenon into the mortise. The whole process has been time consuming but worthwhile. I begin the second set of legs tonight. I expect them to take a few days to complete though. The plan is to have the end stretchers dry fitted to ensure the width is right by Sunday.

Thanks for following.
Sarge240 is offline  
post #14 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 02:47 PM
Master firewood maker
 
Chris Curl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,973
View Chris Curl's Photo Album My Photos
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarge240 View Post
Yes, thanks so much guys.

I am sharpening each chisel with sandpaper and a file. The chisels are cheap, and are getting replaced soon as I can afford to get the Narex set from lee valley.

I plan on sanding each mortise wall down with 150 grit and then 220. That should make for an easier fit and smoother wall.

I also plan to use 5/8 oak dowels to secure the tenon into the mortise. The whole process has been time consuming but worthwhile. I begin the second set of legs tonight. I expect them to take a few days to complete though. The plan is to have the end stretchers dry fitted to ensure the width is right by Sunday.

Thanks for following.
I'm not 100% sure on this, but I *THINK* it might be better to leave the mortise walls unsanded. If you sand them, some of the finer dust could clog the pores which would keep the glue from penetrating as much, which might weaken the resulting joint.

Again, I'm not sure ... can anyone verify or tell me I'm wrong?

Also, you might look into draw-boring the tenons .. they are used to pull the tenon into the joint more, resulting in a tighter joint.

Last edited by Chris Curl; 04-18-2013 at 02:50 PM.
Chris Curl is offline  
post #15 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 04:31 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
I'm doing a no glue design, with the exception of the bench top.

I was referring to draw boring the tenons, I just misworded it, lol.

I completely agree with you Chris, tighter, stronger, better
Sarge240 is offline  
post #16 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 04:59 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Odenton, MD
Posts: 315
View craigwbryant's Photo Album My Photos
I love these workbench threads. I need to get off my 4th point of contact and build one, that is my plan for this summer, once school slows down a bit. I'm looking at using drawbores to attach my stretchers to the legs of the bench to make take down easy since it will have to get packed up and moved every 2-3 years.
craigwbryant is offline  
post #17 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 05:44 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
That's exactly why I'm doing it with no glue. I can pack up and move without starting over
Sarge240 is offline  
post #18 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 07:13 PM
Master firewood maker
 
Chris Curl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,973
View Chris Curl's Photo Album My Photos
i went with a different solution to being able to take it apart and move it: wedges similar to what Paul Sellers does with his workbenches.

It is a good read ... http://paulsellers.com/series/building-a-workbench/

The details on how the wedges work is in part 11 ... http://paulsellers.com/2012/06/making-the-workbench-11/
Chris Curl is offline  
post #19 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Sarge240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 397
View Sarge240's Photo Album My Photos
I considered wedging the open end of the tenon but decided it would be pointless with the draw bored design. Should the wedge come loose, which is common, it would make a loose tenon.

However, if I were to seal the base with varnish, it could seal each wedge in place.
Sarge240 is offline  
post #20 of 64 Old 04-18-2013, 09:59 PM
Senior Member
 
BernieL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Greenville NH
Posts: 1,399
View BernieL's Photo Album My Photos
Sounds like you've thought out your bench and you're on your way. It'll be good to see it coming together.

Its' never hot or cold in New Hampshire... its' always seasonal.
BernieL is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to BernieL For This Useful Post:
AWDsome (05-01-2013)
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
First Project, Workbench banginonabudget Project Showcase 0 03-13-2013 07:18 PM
Yet another workbench project thread. 65BAJA General Woodworking Discussion 20 09-28-2012 12:43 PM
First Workbench Project (New) grindle General Woodworking Discussion 14 06-26-2012 01:45 PM
First Real Woodworking Project - A Workbench Oliver General Woodworking Discussion 5 02-29-2012 07:35 AM
project #1- a simple workbench joetab24 General Woodworking Discussion 9 12-30-2010 01:58 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome