Craftsman Table Saws. - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 10-15-2020, 12:08 PM Thread Starter
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Craftsman Table Saws.

Looking at 2 Craftsman table saws, a 113.24181 which is a 240v 12" saw, and the other a 113.298762 120v 10" saw. Anyone know what the pros and cons of each saw would be, assuming both are in decent working order, and which saw you would prefer?
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post #2 of 12 Old 10-15-2020, 03:10 PM
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I like the fence better on the 120v saw but the table extensions I hate. The open grille will hang on loose knots or splinters. You won't get any more height cut with the 12" saw. You loose the 2" because the blade mounts directly on the motor. The fence on the 12" saw is one of those you have to screw to lock into place. Most upgrade to a different fence system when they get one of those saws. Craftsman does make some great machinery though. I have some I've been using for more than 45 years.
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post #3 of 12 Old 10-15-2020, 03:52 PM
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those old belt drive craftsman table saws are the backbone of most home shops, bought mine in 82, still in use.
i sort of agree with mr neul on the extensions, the plus side is minimal sawdust on them
mine still has the 1982 motor and arbor bearings, minimal maintenance: motor gets a couple drops of oil every year
try to get as many accessories as you can when you buy a saw. blade inserts, dado heads, rip fence and miter gauge

i wouldn't buy a direct drive saw, similar to a circular saw, they have a cheap gear reduction that can't handle ripping
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post #4 of 12 Old 10-15-2020, 04:25 PM
where's my table saw?
 
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The 12" saw is a direct drive, the good kind!

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Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
Looking at 2 Craftsman table saws, a 113.24181 which is a 240v 12" saw, and the other a 113.298762 120v 10" saw. Anyone know what the pros and cons of each saw would be, assuming both are in decent working order, and which saw you would prefer?

I own 3 of the 12" saws, which have been discontinued for about 20 years and I use them all the time. The direct drive contains the motor inside the cabinet which makes for FAR EASIER dust collection that where the motor hangs out the back with the spinning pulley and belt drive. The 12" saw has all the power I need with a think kerf blade.

The fence was barely adequate compared to the Biesemeyer on my other saw, so I changed it to a Delta Unifence, also discontinued for about 20 years.


The fence is actually the heart of the table saw since it's what you adjust each time you rip a different width. It's the most used device on the saw other than the ON/OFF switch. You will find it totally frustrating to operate a table saw with a crappy fence.

And by that I mean, it will not lock parallel to the miter slot or it shifts position from a lack of secure locking mechanism. A front rail locking system is now the "industry standard" for table saw fences, and for good reason. The old system wouldn't align parallel or stay locked once it was aligned properly requiring a two time measurement front and rear each time you adjusted it...
The 12" saw has about 5/16" more depth capacity as I measured mine today. I run 10" blades in mine because they are more available and very reasonable. I still keep a few 12" blades with the 5/8" arbor hole hanging on the shop wall however. The 12" 240 V only saw will run on thinner wire since it's only 1/2 the current draw, but I would still use 12 GA wire regardless. My 3 saws run on a single cord to a 20 AMP 240 V outlet and I can run 2 at the same time, but have no need to do that:



The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #5 of 12 Old 10-15-2020, 08:32 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the replies. I did not know you lose the 2" difference because of the way the 12" blade mounts on the motor. Good info on the fence too.
post #6 of 12 Old 10-16-2020, 07:35 AM
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I’m not familiar the exact model, with but “Craftsman” is enough for me to avoid it (sorry to offend, but it’s based on my experiences with several C’man ww’ing machines). But, it depends on your requirements, your standards and your budget. I’m not saying they won’t work, but you’ll find out the accuracy isn’t there. Just my opinion having used one, others may think they are great.

I would point out why I say this. One, the trunnions are not cast iron and it is mounted to the top, both are signs of a higher quality saw.

Second, fences that clamp between a front a rear rail as no rear rail are not nearly as accurate.

I would definitely avoid the 12” machine. 12” blades are usually on 5HP machines. They are also considerably more expensive to buy and sharpen.

I’m only mentioning this to help give you an idea a there are some things to consider before buying one of these machines.

Robert
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post #7 of 12 Old 10-16-2020, 04:28 PM
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We take it for granted that @[email protected] has (or is planning to add) 240v power in his shop. Is it true?
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post #8 of 12 Old 10-16-2020, 05:20 PM
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I had the 10” belt drive model for a long time. I bought mine with no motor and put a 2hp motor on it. It served me well for a long time. On mine, the “grille” work on the extensions was recessed below the surface and nothing got hung up on them. If the horsepower is equal, the larger 12” blade will have less cutting power because of the larger diameter. I don’t know anyone who is a fan of direct drive motors.
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post #9 of 12 Old 10-16-2020, 05:40 PM
where's my table saw?
 
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If you only had actual experience .....

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Originally Posted by DrRobert View Post
I’m not familiar the exact model, with but “Craftsman” is enough for me to avoid it (sorry to offend, but it’s based on my experiences with several C’man ww’ing machines). But, it depends on your requirements, your standards and your budget. I’m not saying they won’t work, but you’ll find out the accuracy isn’t there. Just my opinion having used one, others may think they are great.

I would point out why I say this. One, the trunnions are not cast iron and it is mounted to the top, both are signs of a higher quality saw.

Second, fences that clamp between a front a rear rail as no rear rail are not nearly as accurate.

I would definitely avoid the 12” machine
. 12” blades are usually on 5HP machines. They are also considerably more expensive to buy and sharpen.

I’m only mentioning this to help give you an idea a there are some things to consider before buying one of these machines.

As a guy who actually owns and uses 3 of them I have a bit more experience with them than you do.
Regarding the 12" direct drive or "motorized" saws, where the armature is actually the arbor, not a gear or belt drive brush type motor:
The trunnions are cast iron. They are mounted to the underside of the table as are most cast iron contractor type saws.
The saw will accept 10" blades and that what I use. The arbor is 5/8" a common size for 10" table saws.
The difference in sharpening costs depends on the number of teeth, not the diameter, at least at my sharpening service.
Either saw of that vintage will have a crappy fence, so that's really a draw.

I don't really care which saw the OP chooses, I'm just sharing my experience of owning these over a 40 year period. FWIW, my first table saw was a Craftsman 10" contractor saw with a crappy fence, purchased in 1960 when I was 18 yrs old with HS graduation money. It never blew up or wore out, but I eventually parted it out when I got the 12" saws and wanted the table for a spacer between them and I still have the wonderful, heavy duty 1 HP motor for a spare. FWIW-2, I also have a newer 10" Craftsman 22124 hybrid which is a great saw which came with a Biesemeyer fence, and is very accurate.


The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)

Last edited by woodnthings; 10-16-2020 at 05:55 PM.
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post #10 of 12 Old 10-17-2020, 12:30 AM Thread Starter
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Yes, I have 240v already in the shop, but haven't purchased a larger saw yet. Currently I have an old small Ryobi benchtop.
post #11 of 12 Old 10-17-2020, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrRobert View Post
Iím not familiar the exact model, with but ďCraftsmanĒ is enough for me to avoid it (sorry to offend, but itís based on my experiences with several Címan wwíing machines). But, it depends on your requirements, your standards and your budget. Iím not saying they wonít work, but youíll find out the accuracy isnít there. Just my opinion having used one, others may think they are great.

I would point out why I say this. One, the trunnions are not cast iron and it is mounted to the top, both are signs of a higher quality saw.

Second, fences that clamp between a front a rear rail as no rear rail are not nearly as accurate.

I would definitely avoid the 12Ē machine. 12Ē blades are usually on 5HP machines. They are also considerably more expensive to buy and sharpen.

Iím only mentioning this to help give you an idea a there are some things to consider before buying one of these machines.



What is a Craftsman ww'ing machine?


In woodworking accuracy is generally in the hands of the user. Most woodworking machines have sufficient accuracy for a good craftsman to attain the final result that he/she needs.


As has been stated many times, the fences on many of the Craftsman lower priced machines are not adequate. The simple solution is to replace the fence.


George
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post #12 of 12 Old 10-18-2020, 10:40 AM
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I meant no offense, regardless , but Címan had some pretty horrible machines at one time, at least. You have to know what youíre looking at and research the myriad # of models.

I based my comments on 2 Címan tablesaws I owned, admittedly years ago. One had a fence so horribly designed I almost lost a thumb, one you could actually flex the wings. Bandsaw was even worse.

As woodnthings indicates there are probably newer models that are better. Not all of them have cast iron trunnions.

But I will maintain my position that avoiding a direct drive universal type motor and cast iron trunnions are still a good idea.

Robert
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