how do you guys bid trim work? - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
 
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post #1 of 17 Old 11-06-2012, 08:50 AM Thread Starter
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how do you guys bid trim work?

Hey guys, im a painter by trade, i have a client whom would like me to also do the trim out. its fairly simple, pre-hung doors, pre primed mdf trim boards, etc. all materials are being provided. the best way ive thought up so far is to look basically at the time to install doors, cabinets, with simple casing and base do you all price based on time or do you do a lin footage? also out of general curiosity, as this house has no stairs, do you do the labor for rails by your time or the lin foot or?.
Painting in residential new construction is typically done by the square foot, but that seems impractical with all of the variables of trim work.
thanks in advance for all reply's.. the change of pace here would be i will be cussing myself come time to caulk it all in and reset nails
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post #2 of 17 Old 11-06-2012, 10:32 AM
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By the day based on many years of experience and with the knowledge of what the going prices are.
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post #3 of 17 Old 11-06-2012, 10:45 AM
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If materials are being provided, by the hour, or by the day would CYA.





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post #4 of 17 Old 11-06-2012, 09:38 PM
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I never bid any work by the foot, even cabinets. Each job has different circumstances so I estimate how much labor and materials it takes. Since you are having the materials supplied it would make it easier. Usually where I get in trouble is I will find out how much materials it takes to do a job and by the time the customer gives me the go ahead prices go up. What I would do is estimate how many days it would take to do the trim work and add a day or two because it always takes longer than what you think.
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post #5 of 17 Old 11-06-2012, 10:12 PM
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It sounds like you don't have much experience doing trim work so it might be hard to estimate how long it will take you to do it. That being the case, giving the customer an hourly price for your labor works out in your best interest. It's not always best for the customer though if it takes longer than you or he thinks it will. In the past I've given an hourly rate with a cap in the overall cost so that it protects both of you at least to a point.

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post #6 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 06:27 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input everyone, i think i will do as the majority seems to concur and just go by how long it will take me. should be a bit of a simpler equation as there is no crown, and the look is going to be mission esque. The goal is more so keeping busy rather than huge profit on this one, as this is the slow time for painting.
Do most of you provide your own materials? seems like that could get to be a hefty sum to carry. maybe it just seems that to me beings an interior is typically 500-1000 worth of materials.
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post #7 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 07:14 AM
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I prefer to supply my own materials. Usually when I leave it up to the customer they find some ill-fitting junk that takes more work to make it work than it cost to begin with. As far as the cost when I do a job I get half down and the other half upon completion. This covers the materials so if you get stiffed on a job you just lost your time.
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post #8 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 07:17 AM
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I normally require a deposit for any work I do. When I did construction the norm would be this much to start plus a pay schedule if it was over a long period of time. I would never bear the cost of materials in either case, never know when a customer might change their mind about some detail. Extras are always on the menu lol

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post #9 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 07:34 AM Thread Starter
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Yes i like deposits on jobs, typically go for 25% which for painting covers the material cost. I've heard some say there clients don't care for doing deposits, but i always express it as you know, i like to do a 25% material deposit, if you aren't comfortable with that owner provided material is an option, as well as telling them my preferred paint stores and product line. Never had anyone object.
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post #10 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by troyd1976 View Post
Yes i like deposits on jobs, typically go for 25% which for painting covers the material cost. I've heard some say there clients don't care for doing deposits, but i always express it as you know, i like to do a 25% material deposit, if you aren't comfortable with that owner provided material is an option, as well as telling them my preferred paint stores and product line. Never had anyone object.
If you have established credibility with the client, a deposit shouldn't be a problem. I've found that if there is a problem with money in the beginning, there is a likelihood there will be a problem at the end.

As for materials, I prefer to supply my own. At least that way, I know what I'm working with. In some cases, the price could be figured on what is carried to the jobsite, especially if it has a finish.




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post #11 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 09:08 AM
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I'll have to double check but I'm thinking here in Tennessee it is illegal to collect any monies before any work is done by contractors.
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post #12 of 17 Old 11-07-2012, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Rlbtn4171 View Post
I'll have to double check but I'm thinking here in Tennessee it is illegal to collect any monies before any work is done by contractors.
hmmmm, remind me not to work in Tennessee, lol!!
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post #13 of 17 Old 11-08-2012, 09:49 AM
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In California you are only able to ask for 10% down or $1000. Whichever is less. As a stair builder this never covers the cost of materials. I have them sign a contract with a referenced invoice and payment schedule in addition to their non-refundable deposit. This seems to be a good balance for me and the customers. Many times I will be collecting deposits and having the contract signed a month or more before the work will begin. To ask a customer to give me 35% of the job up front and then not see them for that period of time would be a lot to ask. At least it would be if I were that customer. Lets face it, contractors don't have the best reputation when it comes to collecting money and then skipping town.

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post #14 of 17 Old 11-08-2012, 03:52 PM
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Yeah let me be a little clearer on what I stated. The way I understand the contractor law here in TN. Is that you just cannot ask for monies up front. Once work has been done you can charge for your progress. This just applies to " contractors" as I understand it.
I build homes and do remodels etc. I have never asked for deposits upfront. I usually collect monthly say on a house or just the total when finished on smaller jobs.
I haven't been " stuck" as of yet. Lucky I guess but it's trust on both sides. Ive heard of horror stories but so far has worked. Good contract goes long way if it comes down to nitty gritty. But it's hard to get blood out of a turnip. It's easy to see both sides. IMHO
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post #15 of 17 Old 11-08-2012, 09:03 PM
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I spent a few years trimming for an employer before I took a house on my own, so had some experience and technique by that time.

My first house was still somewhat overwhelming, it was a large place in an upscale development which all had crown, chair rail, 5 1/4" base, hardwood staircases, etc. I worked out a "per hole" bid price that includes all the things that other trimmers considered extras. A hole being a door or window, of course. So I'd count up the number of interior & exterior doors and windows in the house, and multiply by the figure I had come up with.
The figure was based upon how long it would take to complete the job (the builder supplied materials), taking into consideration paying my helper and making the estimated hourly rate I wanted.
Pay schedule was 35% on trim out, 65% after finish out.
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post #16 of 17 Old 12-04-2012, 11:39 AM
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Usually where I get in trouble is I will find out how much materials it takes to do a job and by the time the customer gives me the go ahead prices go up.

After getting burned like that, I include a clause in any bids which limits the time, usually 30 days, as the time in which that bid price will be in effect. I'll also add any price changes by suppliers will be passed on without mark up to the customer. In this way, people I may have given a price to months ago will understand that price may not still be valid.
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post #17 of 17 Old 12-04-2012, 01:41 PM
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I would do it by an hourly rate and maybe offer to do some some window treatment installation too. I think it would be a fairly quick job and I wouldn't want to just be there for only a couple hour job. But that's just me.

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Last edited by Gregg30!; 12-12-2012 at 03:09 PM.
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