Crown problem - walls and ceiling not square - Page 2 - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
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post #21 of 40 Old 12-14-2010, 01:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrbrown View Post
Huh? A corner is what the angle finder says it is and the miters are cut to half of the angle. If your cutting a corner for an angle wall and its a 45 degree angle you cut the miters at 22.5, if the corner is 88 then the miters are cut at 44.
Yeah, I see your point but he is talking about setting your saw for coping. No, wait that's how you do it for mitered inside corners. Sorry, I've been building doors for a couple years now. I only make 90 and 45 degree cuts. Took me a minute to think back to trim carpentry.

Last edited by sketel; 12-14-2010 at 01:15 AM.
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post #22 of 40 Old 12-14-2010, 12:03 PM
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Yup you are right. Technically 44 is 1/2 of 88. The problem is in part that the chop saw is set at zero, and the other thing is that we usually cut our piece "face out"! aha!

so measuring from the back side of the piece, it will be 44 deg, so that means from the front side it has to be 46. (44+46=90)

I gotta sit down and draw it out so that I can explain it better! the fault here is mine, I am a poor teacher.

Basically we are adjusting things so that the machinery gives us what we want.
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post #23 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 09:20 AM
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If you bevel your inside corner cope very aggressively, leaving a fairly long, sharply pointed edge, small mismatches in adjoining angles will be no problem.

This is because if you cut your piece a little long (like an eighth of an inch, or so) the pressure it will exert when forced (pushed with a spring bow in the wood) into place, the sharp edge you just coped will slightly 'crush' and form itself to the already installed piece.
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post #24 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 09:54 AM
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Yeah I agree with you there Willie. You can run one piece square to the wall and cut the other one on the miter cope and it will work. Big advantage to coping.
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post #25 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 10:45 AM
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This is why I used the prefab corner.
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post #26 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 10:58 AM
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Cope them

I was on a job where all I had was a saber saw, miter saw, a belt sander and a table saw. I ran the table saw blade up as far as it would go and then used it to cope, by wasting away the material under the bevel. Then that coped length was fit into the straight section stuck fully into the inside corner. The saber saw worked fair, but hard to control without one of those coping shoes. The belt sander nose also removed the ragged portions left from the table saw. I clamped it to a work table. Worked just fine. bill

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #27 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post
I was on a job where all I had was a saber saw, miter saw, a belt sander and a table saw. I ran the table saw blade up as far as it would go and then used it to cope, by wasting away the material under the bevel. Then that coped length was fit into the straight section stuck fully into the inside corner. The saber saw worked fair, but hard to control without one of those coping shoes. The belt sander nose also removed the ragged portions left from the table saw. I clamped it to a work table. Worked just fine. bill

On short pieces it's just as easy to run the TS blade @45 and use a miter gauge to pass the backside straight through the blade. But, with long pieces like 16' its a PITA. Actually, I find a coping saw to be the fastest most accurate way.










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post #28 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabinetman

On short pieces it's just as easy to run the TS blade @45 and use a miter gauge to pass the backside straight through the blade. But, with long pieces like 16' its a PITA. Actually, I find a coping saw to be the fastest most accurate way.




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I agree with cab man to many guys around that look at the coping saw as the Ebola virus. If the wall is that far out and you can determine the angle. Yes with the Bosch You can cut the inside miter to this degree cope it with the virus and it will fall right into place. Really not hard don't no why this causes so much trepedation. The key is letting the saw do the work. When my dad trained me he taught me to grip the handle with two fingers when you finally get it you can cut and rasp the cut all in one motion . A good exercise he used to make me do is he would cut six lefts and six rights and make me cut all twelve every day for a month. Then he would take them and try them against another piece of crown and tell me how many sat nice without cleaning them. Another thing he showed me was when your coping with the crown set up on an angle is to stand over it look straight down so you could see if any meat is pertruding past the edge meaning the back bevel of the cut. I was lucky to have a master craftsman as a dad to teach me but You all can teach yourself. Practice use your break and part of your lunch instead of using it to smoke cigarettes. Or cope with one in your mouth
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post #29 of 40 Old 12-15-2010, 01:27 PM
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Just a note to add to all of the wonderful tips and techniques. I picked up a pair of crown moulding holders that hold the crown in place while you install, makes it easy for one person to do the install. I picked them up form Lee Valley Tools. Its like a second pair of hands, and I have found them to be invaluable many times.
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post #30 of 40 Old 12-16-2010, 09:24 AM
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Do yourself a BIG favor if you do a lot of crown.
Buy at least a half dozen, or a dozen, of these sharp pointed spring clamps.
Get a set of pliers too, the springs are kind of hard to open by hand.

Lay some 2p-10 glue on the fitted joint, spray the activator, and slip the clamps on. Beautiful corners.

You might want to take a look at Basswood’s grinder coping technique too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EijqMNYBsLg
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Last edited by Willie T; 12-16-2010 at 09:31 AM.
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post #31 of 40 Old 12-16-2010, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willie T
Do yourself a BIG favor if you do a lot of crown.
Buy at least a half dozen, or a dozen, of these sharp pointed spring clamps.
Get a set of pliers too, the springs are kind of hard to open by hand.

Lay some 2p-10 glue on the fitted joint, spray the activaror, and slip the clamps on. Beautiful corners.
I have the glue but Where do we get those nifty clamps . Do they slip a lot of my crown is prefinished
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post #32 of 40 Old 12-16-2010, 10:14 AM
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I have the glue but Where do we get those nifty clamps . Do they slip a lot of my crown is prefinished
A lot of places sell them, like here. They don't slip per se, but they will leave a divot.









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post #33 of 40 Old 12-16-2010, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabinetman

A lot of places sell them, like here. They don't slip per se, but they will leave a divot.




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Thanks to bad I saw these right before the holidays I'll Have to let my helper go and get these LOL
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post #34 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 01:14 AM
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Although those clips are great, I just used mine to hold a pair of paddes up while I gave them a few coats of marine varnish. I was thinking of these from Lee Valley http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...45&cat=1,43456

Last edited by fixrite; 12-17-2010 at 01:16 AM.
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post #35 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by fixrite View Post
Although those clips are great, I just used mine to hold a pair of paddes up while I gave them a few coats of marine varnish. I was thinking of these from Lee Valley http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...45&cat=1,43456
I always just used a 10d finish nail to hold the end up for me.

http://www.diychatroom.com/

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post #36 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by jiju1943 View Post
I always just used a 10d finish nail to hold the end up for me.

Working alone can be a PITA. I found this adjustable bar from HF. I have 4 of them and they are a life saver. Periodically, they go on sale for $12.99.

Here's a picture of it holding a backer on a concrete wall.

Crown problem - walls and ceiling not square-j5juvn.jpg










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post #37 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by cabinetman View Post
Working alone can be a PITA. I found this adjustable bar from HF. I have 4 of them and they are a life saver. Periodically, they go on sale for $12.99.

Here's a picture of it holding a backer on a concrete wall.

Attachment 19063












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Man, that is a bargain there, I haven't seen them before. It would be kinda hard to drive a 10d finish nail in a concrete wall. Thanks buddy, I appreciate that.

http://www.diychatroom.com/

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post #38 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabinetman View Post
A lot of places sell them, like here. They don't slip per se, but they will leave a divot.
Prefinished won't shrink as much, but with unfinished crown you will be surprised how much some hot water dabbed on with a sponge will reduce the size of the little holes the clamps leave.
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post #39 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 11:58 AM
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Fast Cap, I think, also makes a similar bar called "Third Hand". Although they are more expensive than the HF brand, each one will hold a lot more weight. I have four of the Third Hands, and use them all the time to install upper cabinets.

Recently I had to adjust a full wall of eight installed cabinets. (they needed to be 9/16" lower to clear a beam feature) The Third Hands helped me get the whole job done in about twenty minutes.

I don't know how I ever got along without them.
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post #40 of 40 Old 12-17-2010, 03:01 PM
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Smile

These are the holders for the crown while doing a one man installation. I got mine from Lee Valley. They work great and leave no marks as you simple hang them on a nail behind the crown in the void.
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