Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum

Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum (https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/forum.php)
-   Power Tools & Machinery (https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f12/)
-   -   using dovetail machine (https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f12/using-dovetail-machine-3007/)

tcc 01-29-2008 08:47 PM

using dovetail machine
 
I have a grizzly g0611x dovetail machine and having problems with breaking bits I am using 5/8 hard maple drawer sides and probably break a bit every 5 drawers or so. anybody have any experience with dovetail machines in general? I'm using the bits sold from Grizzly they are solid carbide, wondering if their is a better source for bits that will fit this machine?

Thanks

Paul K 01-29-2008 08:59 PM

wow, that is about $5 per drawer then?, pretty expensive. I have used a Leigh for many years, a much simpler (and more complex) machine. I have never broken a bit in hundreds of drawers. Certainly I have had to get them resharpened. I assume this has a power feed mechanism, maybe pushing it a bit too fast? Maybe the solid carbid is a bit too brittle? I have always just used the carbide tipped bits. What does Grizzly say? They have to agree that one bit for 5 drawers is a bit crazy. What is special about the bit? usual angles are 7 and 9 deg, but doesn't the same bit cut the tails and the pocket? So what difference does it make? (there I go trying to help with a question!)

tcc 01-29-2008 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul K (Post 21680)
wow, that is about $5 per drawer then?, pretty expensive. I have used a Leigh for many years, a much simpler (and more complex) machine. I have never broken a bit in hundreds of drawers. Certainly I have had to get them resharpened. I assume this has a power feed mechanism, maybe pushing it a bit too fast? Maybe the solid carbide is a bit too brittle? I have always just used the carbide tipped bits. What does Grizzly say? They have to agree that one bit for 5 drawers is a bit crazy. What is special about the bit? usual angles are 7 and 9 deg, but doesn't the same bit cut the tails and the pocket? So what difference does it make? (there I go trying to help with a question!)

http://www.grizzly.com/images/pics/jpeg288/h/h9388.jpg

10 deg eccentric single wing cutter, looks like the same cutter that both powermatic and dodds dovetail maichine's use. the manual talkes about resharpining the bids so i have to belive they are ment to last a long time. the miching is not power feed and i do excersize control and feed slowly. I am using up the last of my hard maple and wonder if I should just start using soft maple? if i could find this bit from another sourch maybe it would not be solid carbide or just made in USA.

thanks

johnep 01-30-2008 03:19 AM

I believe Freud bits are a combination of steel with embedded carbide.
johnep

Paul K 01-30-2008 06:11 PM

I think I would first ask Grizzly what might be the problem, second, I'd get bits from someone else, and ideally carbide tipped, not solid. I have made a lot of drawers using hard maple too, though mostly the drawer fronts were hard maple, and I generally used birch, ash or something else for the sides. Again, I certainly burned a few up, and had to sharpen them often enough, but even that I don't doubt but that i could cut 20 or so before it needed sharpening again. If you are self feeding, and of course the real problem is shock. you have to go into the cut slowly. Direction of cut might also be a problem. router bits grab going one direction and not the other. And of course a dovetail bit is narrow waisted, and thus they can break. I assume you are using a 1/4" shank, and that, with the right degree, is going to make a fagile shank. Since carbide is so hard, it is also more brittle, so perhaps that is the problem? Anyway a few thoughts

best
paul

tcc 01-30-2008 07:31 PM

thanks
 
I would have to agree I also think it is the carbide. I have not yet spoken to Grizzly. the bits are not your standard 1/4 or 1/2" shank, so not just any bit will work, I did find a bit that is from Powermatic it costs app 10.00 more but maybe it will be made with a steel shank or just better carbide. I have made 100's of drawers with the old jig and router and have only broken a couple in my life, I bought this dovetail machine a few months ago and as far as setup and use, its great but I need to know what’s up with the broken bits. will call grizzly tomorrow.

thanks

Yukonjim 04-11-2011 11:59 AM

dovetails and broken bits
 
for 19 yrs i used a rockwell router and rarely borke a bit. Changed router , guide collar, etc and did the same as you every 5-10 boxes broke a good bit freud, whiteside, bosch. still trying to resolve issue. For now keep in mind it could be a damaged collet, guide collar misaligned, misaligned base. I'll keep you informed, if you find out anything I'd appreciate the info myself.:smile:

Yukonjim 04-12-2011 06:30 AM

bit breakage
 
I experienced a bit breakage problem when I switched from an old often used Rockwell to a beautiful new Bosch router. After many questions, many helpful replys and a thorough examination of all equipment used I determined that when I was making my fine adjustments for the exact depth of the bit I was not paying attention to the collet position in reference to the guide collar. The collet was in contact with the guide collar. For now I'm assuming this improper contact had something to do with the bit breakage. As I have the need to do additional dovetails I'll update you with farther results with the collet not hittingthe guide collar. My clue was a reply to my question telling to use an o ring to keep the collet spacing correct..

cabinetbob 05-05-2016 11:11 AM

TC,

I guess by now you figured out the breaking of the bits? How do you like the grizzly DT machine? I'm thinking of getting one or a foxshop one. I want the 16 1/2" capability. Are you able to get a pre cut on the pins before doing a complete cut?

Hooligan13 09-28-2016 05:19 PM

I am having the same issue with broken bits. I am curious if a solution was found.

MEP1 09-28-2016 11:06 PM

OP hasn't been back here since 2008, I doubt at this point he'll be back for an update.

Steve Neul 09-28-2016 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hooligan13 (Post 1481177)
I am having the same issue with broken bits. I am curious if a solution was found.

In all likelihood the problem was with the bits instead of the machine.

cabinetbob 09-29-2016 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hooligan13 (Post 1481177)
I am having the same issue with broken bits. I am curious if a solution was found.

Are you referring to using the shopfox DT machine? I myself am using the W1805 machine. Just bought a few months ago. The only thing about broken bits is, I notice my chaser guide had some shiny parts on it. Then I realized my tracer pin was set too deep. I trashed that bit. Good thing I had already bought an extra bit. Other than that, use it like you use a regular DT jig, slow & steady,

Toolman50 09-29-2016 11:20 AM

I have never broken a dovetail router bit. I used cheap 1/4" shank non-carbide for the first 20 years of my woodwork. I've been using 1/4" shank carbide tipped cutters for the past 20 years. I've cut a lot of dovetails over 40 years. No broken bits. I never sharpen the bits. When they get dull, I toss them out.
If your breaking bits, you must be putting tremendous stress on the bit. You may be using a jerking motion.

GeorgeC 09-29-2016 02:07 PM

What is a dovetail "machine.\?"

George

woodnthings 09-29-2016 04:31 PM

Go to Grizzly type in...
 

Toolman50 09-29-2016 05:40 PM

Thanks very much for the picture. By the way, your good and fast with the pictures. The dovetail machine pictured is a little too much for my garage workshop. :grin:
Very nice if I was running a shop building desk or drawers all the time.
If bits are breaking on that type set up, I would start slowing the machine down and see if that helps. :yes:

Leo G 09-29-2016 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toolman50 (Post 1481729)
I have never broken a dovetail router bit. I used cheap 1/4" shank non-carbide for the first 20 years of my woodwork. I've been using 1/4" shank carbide tipped cutters for the past 20 years. I've cut a lot of dovetails over 40 years. No broken bits. I never sharpen the bits. When they get dull, I toss them out.
If your breaking bits, you must be putting tremendous stress on the bit. You may be using a jerking motion.

I've broken dozens of bits and I've tried everything from slow to fast to adjusting the RPMs of the router. But I'm routing Baltic Birch which has a lot of glue which heats up the bit. Sometimes they last 5 drawers sometimes, 25. But eventually they break on me.

Steve Neul 09-29-2016 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toolman50 (Post 1482017)
Thanks very much for the picture. By the way, your good and fast with the pictures. The dovetail machine pictured is a little too much for my garage workshop. :grin:
Very nice if I was running a shop building desk or drawers all the time.
If bits are breaking on that type set up, I would start slowing the machine down and see if that helps. :yes:

I bet if you paid the $3600.00 for it you would find a spot.:smile3:

Zion212 10-04-2016 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Neul (Post 1482257)
I bet if you paid the $3600.00 for it you would find a spot.:smile3:http://goo.gl/8f5L4q

If I paid that much I would build a spot to store it. Looks great though.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:14 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome