Lathe 'play' along spindle axis - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
 
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post #1 of 9 Old 02-19-2019, 02:25 PM Thread Starter
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Unhappy Lathe 'play' along spindle axis

Hi,

I'm new to woodturning and I picked up a really cheap second hand lathe. I figured that using this lathe for the first few projects would give me a good idea as of what I need in a lathe if I want to go further with it.
Meanwhile I'll invest in some attachments along the way which I can keep when I upgrade.

Now the lathe that I bought looks like a DIY model, it's old and if has a few broken parts...

Anway I wanted to ask...
The lathe's headstock spindle can move along the axis, and I trying to figure out if this is normal.
On the one hand I would thing that since the motor spins the belt and thus the spindle it will even out and allow it to correct itself. On the other hand I think it's not normal since if you use a tailstock center you would put a little pressure on it and make the belt go sideways.

To clearify the problem I uploaded a film to youtube demonstrating my problem:

I'm using a hammer to move it since it was a little akward with a camera in one hand. But I can move it by hand fairly easy if i apply a little pressure.

I don't see how it would be prevented from spinning. On each side of the headstock there are threaded holes but they match no holes in the spindle so other than 'clamping' to the spindle I see no way to secure it. (see photos)

A couple of questions that I have:

Is it normal that the spindle can move that way?
If so, how should I solve this?

Right now i'm suspecting that there should be bolts in the holes as show on the photos. I guess they went missing at the previous owner.

Hoping someone can give me some hits.
Thank you a lot already!
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post #2 of 9 Old 02-19-2019, 06:43 PM
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I am guessing it is a bearing with a locking collar such as shown here or it could just be a collar on the bearing that needs a set screw:


Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something -Plato

FrankC
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post #3 of 9 Old 02-20-2019, 01:40 AM Thread Starter
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Thank you! That actually makes sense.

I have such collar on the thread and pulley side.

I’m guessing that I should put set screws in both holes on each collar. Also it probably should be aligned so the motor and spindle pulley are on one line.
Is this correct ?

I’ll order some set screws asap and probably clean up the spindle axis with some sandpaper while i’m at it. In the video the axle moves way more smooth then mine does when no screws are inserted.

I just seems weird that a couple of small set screws can hold the axle in place. Am I missing something here?
It’s probably because I’m new to wood turning and the tailstock should not apply much pressure but only support the piece. But what about a drill in the tailstock... wouldn’t I just push through the set screws and push it out of position?
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post #4 of 9 Old 02-20-2019, 12:40 PM
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Proper set screws will bite into the shaft and lock it in place tight enough for general use on a wood lathe, yes if there are two threaded holes use two screws. A sharp drill will cut the wood so it should not move the shaft. It is not a bullet proof system but adequate.

My local Home Depot has bins of fasteners which includes Allen set screws so you may may be able to get them locally.

Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something -Plato

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Last edited by FrankC; 02-20-2019 at 12:51 PM.
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post #5 of 9 Old 02-20-2019, 01:47 PM
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You will notice a groove in the shaft for a snap ring. Once you replace this ring...tap the end of the threaded shaft (protect the threads with a wood block) until the ring contacts the bearing, then add the set screws to lock the shaft in place. Align the pulley last and lock in place with set screws.

Gary

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post #6 of 9 Old 02-20-2019, 11:51 PM
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Hi


You may also want to clean the rust off of the shaft.
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post #7 of 9 Old 02-21-2019, 01:24 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankC View Post
Proper set screws will bite into the shaft and lock it in place tight enough for general use on a wood lathe, yes if there are two threaded holes use two screws. A sharp drill will cut the wood so it should not move the shaft. It is not a bullet proof system but adequate.

My local Home Depot has bins of fasteners which includes Allen set screws so you may may be able to get them locally.
I checked online and found some RSV (stainless steel) ones for 0.20 EUR but shipping was 15 EUR on them. So I stopped at the local DIY store and picked up some 0.10 EUR set screws but the shortest were 45mm which is too long since it they would touch the bearing casing bolts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmercer_48083 View Post
https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/atta...s-img_0665.jpg

You will notice a groove in the shaft for a snap ring. Once you replace this ring...tap the end of the threaded shaft (protect the threads with a wood block) until the ring contacts the bearing, then add the set screws to lock the shaft in place. Align the pulley last and lock in place with set screws.
I fail to locate the groove. If there should be a snap ring it's missing.
The only groove that i can see/feel is right behind the thread.


But placing a snap ring here and tapping until the ring touches the collar of the bearing would locate the shaft in such a way that the grub/set aren't in full contact with the shaft. Since there is a stepdown

Bearing held in place by hand to illustrate set/screw not fitting:



Full shaft to illustrate stepdown


Another option would be that there should be a snap ring on the first shoulder after the thread, which would make more sense. But there is no groove there..

Could you point out where the snap ring should be?


Quote:
Originally Posted by ajdragon View Post
Hi


You may also want to clean the rust off of the shaft.
Yep!


Thank you for the comments I'll take your advise into account when proceeding.


What happend meanwhile...

I wanted to clean the rust on the shaft so it could easily move when not tightened down (as shown in the bearing video posted by FrankC.
Since I couldn't access the shaft properly I decided to take it out to give it a proper cleaning. Whilst doing that I noticed that there is some play in the bearings. Meanwhile (see above) I was having trouble getting the right length set screws.
I could probably get away with the amount of play in the bearing. Since they are self centring bearings some play is normal.
I decided that since I have everything open now I'll replace the bearings while I'm at it. I found the identical sized bearings at SKF (which is known around here for good quality bearings):
https://www.skf.com/group/products/b...tion=YAT%20205
Doing so I don't have to worry about the right grub/set screws since they come with the bearing (i hope).

The only potential issue I see right now is that the bearings assume a h6 tolerance shaft, which gives me -0 -13 micrometers of tolerance on the shaft. I'm worried that the rust has damaged the shaft too much.
The bearings aren't that expensive (+- 35 EUR for a set) and I got the lathe for cheap (50 EUR). So I'll just go for it, keeping in mind that I only want to touch up this lathe for get some practical experience to decide on an upgrade later on.
I was checking to get a new spindle shaft (if needed) but couldn't find one (in a fast google search) that has the right dimensions. The advantage would be that I can get one with a more standard thread of M33 X 2.5 (europe standard) instead of the not so common 3/4 inch 10 TPI thread that is on my current one. Allowing me to get accessoires more easily. Right now i'll stick with an adapter so I can mount M33 accessoires so I can keep then once I upgrade.

Anyway next steps will be:

- Clean up the shaft, being careful not to rough it up to much where the bearings should sit.
- Replace the bearings
- Put the shaft in place with a snap ring? If I can locate the right position to put it...
- Lock in place with the set screws
- Fix/replace the pulley (since I noticed some play there also, motor pulley seems fine)
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post #8 of 9 Old 02-21-2019, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmercer_48083 View Post
https://www.woodworkingtalk.com/atta...s-img_0665.jpg


You will notice a groove in the shaft for a snap ring. Once you replace this ring...tap the end of the threaded shaft (protect the threads with a wood block) until the ring contacts the bearing, then add the set screws to lock the shaft in place. Align the pulley last and lock in place with set screws.
It appeared to me that in this photo that there was a groove in the shaft for a snap ring...I WAS WRONG, which became obvious after seeing the photo with the shaft removed. In my mind a snap ring would keep the shaft from drifting inward as you apply pressure against it from your tailstock. Set screws alone, to me just would not be enough holding strength. That was my only thought. Sorry for the miss direction.

Gary

Woodworking is like wetting myself....Only I know that warm feeling!
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post #9 of 9 Old 02-21-2019, 11:37 AM
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Not to discourage you, but looking at the spindle and noticing that it appears to have internal threads rather than a Morse taper and reading it has a 3/4 - 10 external thread I would really evaluate how much time and effort is worth putting in to the machine. I don't know where you live but used wood lathes with common tapers and threads and often including some accessories are very reasonable around here.

Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something -Plato

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