Did my Delta 36-725 die? - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 02-22-2020, 06:39 PM Thread Starter
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Angry Did my Delta 36-725 die?

Hello,

I've had this saw for 5-6 years. Running on 240v and never an issue. Until yesterday.

I've been using the saw quite a bit lately. Built a bathroom vanity, trimmed a bunch of baseboard and door and window casings and yesterday, I turned it on, it powered up and before I fed the material the motor stopped. Got out the owners manual and found the reset button. So I reset it and now the motor runs backwards. Yup, backwards.

Any ideas?

Thanks a lot for your time,

Steve in Dahlonega
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post #2 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 06:40 AM
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It did not die, it is still running. Just backwards.


Did you try pressing the reset button a second time? Have you unplugged the motor and then plugged in again? (this often cures problems with digital devices, but I do not know why it would help with an analog device. However it cannot hurt to try.)



Does your motor have a wiring diagram on it? Or does the manual?


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post #3 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 09:44 AM
where's my table saw?
 
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Backwards ?

It's a belt drive, so temove the belt and turn it on. Note the direction it wants to turn, CW or CCW. Turn it off and spin it in the opposite direction so it's spinning that way when you restart it, you'll need to be quick about it. See if it will restart in that direction each time. If so, then it may be "fixed" .... I donno?


If it continues to run in the "wrong" direction, reverse the wires inside the cover that determine rotation.

https://www.hunker.com/13414114/how-...phase-ac-motor
Single Phase Motor Direction Change ......



The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)

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post #4 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 11:49 AM Thread Starter
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Backwards

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeC View Post
It did not die, it is still running. Just backwards.


Did you try pressing the reset button a second time? Have you unplugged the motor and then plugged in again? (this often cures problems with digital devices, but I do not know why it would help with an analog device. However it cannot hurt to try.)

Does your motor have a wiring diagram on it? Or does the manual?


George
I did press the reset button a second and then a third and fourth time. No luck.

I did unplug the unit as I revised the connections from 240v to the switch.

I haven't been able to find a wiring diagram online, however, why would all of the sudden start doing this if I had not messed with anything before it happened?
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post #5 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 11:54 AM Thread Starter
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Backwards

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Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post
It's a belt drive, so temove the belt and turn it on. Note the direction it wants to turn, CW or CCW. Turn it off and spin it in the opposite direction so it's spinning that way when you restart it, you'll need to be quick about it. See if it will restart in that direction each time. If so, then it may be "fixed" .... I donno?


If it continues to run in the "wrong" direction, reverse the wires inside the cover that determine rotation.

https://www.hunker.com/13414114/how-...phase-ac-motor
Single Phase Motor Direction Change ......


I might try that. I first read in different forums that it might be the start capacitor or the run capacitor (Apparently it has both). A licensed electrician friend of mine suggested spinning the blade in the correct direction by hand (Push stick in my case) and as its spinning, start the motor. And it started, backwards, again. So yes, I might change connections 5-8, but why? What happened from earlier that morning that it was running just fine to running backwards after an overheated motor reset?

----------------------
Steve in Dahlonega
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post #6 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 04:53 PM
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If the start capacitor circuit fails, the motor will hum for a few seconds and then likely trip the circuit breaker supplying the saw.

If the power switch fails the saw won't start.

If the circuit breaker feeding the saw is tripped, the motor won't start.

You need to test the circuit to see if it has power at the plug, then at the switch, then after the switch at the motor. Only then will you have a clue as to what is wrong with your saw.

Check these out and let us know the results.

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post #7 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 05:42 PM
where's my table saw?
 
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The saw runs, just in reverse rotation......

It won't be the switch, or the circuit breaker, and since it runs, it has power. It is certainly a mystery why it runs backwards. If it is consistent and always runs backwards, then as I suggested, reverse the wiring to change the rotation. If that works, that all that's needed.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #8 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 06:09 PM
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Is it a cap start or does it have a centrifugal switch. Sounds to me like the CS has failed open. You will normally here it close when you turn the motor off, just before it stops rotating.


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post #9 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 07:32 PM
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Have you lost power on one side of the line? When I was in manufacturing, we used to call that "single phasing". I wouldn't rewire without a good reason. Do you have a voltmeter?
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post #10 of 26 Old 02-23-2020, 08:04 PM
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Obviously, the motor has to be "reversible" .....

Quote:
Originally Posted by woodnthings View Post
It won't be the switch, or the circuit breaker, and since it runs, it has power. It is certainly a mystery why it runs backwards. If it is consistent and always runs backwards, then as I suggested, reverse the wiring to change the rotation. If that works, that all that's needed.
Most induction motors over 1 HP are reversible, so that why I recommend trying the reverse wiring approach.

In the short term, if you need to complete a project, just twist the belt. It's a farmer's trick on tractor driven flat belt combines to get them to run proper. Yes, the belt will rub on itself, but in an "emergency", belts are cheap.

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The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #11 of 26 Old 02-24-2020, 07:06 AM
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Have the capacitor checked. HVAC or electricical shop should be able to check it for you. Did you also check that you have 240volts at the motor and not just 120v?
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Last edited by Maintenance Man; 02-24-2020 at 07:09 AM.
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post #12 of 26 Old 02-24-2020, 09:08 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Have the capacitor checked. HVAC or electricical shop should be able to check it for you. Did you also check that you have 240volts at the motor and not just 120v?
Monday, early afternoon:

Steve: Honey, I'm going to call Delta PowerTools and see what happens. - She gives me an eye roll.

Steve dials and after 4 tries and 20 minutes gets a live person.

Delta Customer Service: What seems to be the problem?

Steve explains everything I've explained here and finishes with: Have you ever heard such a thing? A Saw spinning backwards?

DCS: Yes, I have.

Steve:

DCS: Pretty sure it's the capacitor.

DCS proceeds to give Steve the model number of the run and start capacitors and a phone number to purchase them.

Steve thanks him profusely and proceeds to his tool box where he has a 45uF 370/440VAC capacitor from his previous house's HVAC. He will replace the run cap. The table saw calls for a 40uF 370VAC.

Steve installs said capacitor and the saw still spins backwards. One more time.

Frustrated, Steve will order the start and run caps via Amazon, that are approximately $15/each instead of the $75 and $50 quoted for the Delta OEM Caps.

PS: He's is not able to find his multi-meter to test the capacitors. He knows its somewhere in the basement, but cannot locate it at the moment.

----------------------
Steve in Dahlonega
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post #13 of 26 Old 02-25-2020, 12:59 PM
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You seem to be going in the right direction, I am not an electrician but I do know from experience that electric motors will spin when plugged in, however they may be running only on the starting windings and have no torque, bought a few like this at swap meets.

Something has happened to cause your motor to run in reverse, probably best to figure out what before you let out the smoke. 😊
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post #14 of 26 Old 02-26-2020, 06:51 AM
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does it spin in reverse at full power and speed from what you can tell? my guess is that you did lose one leg of the power. it could be the switch, capacitor, or?? you will need to check the power at the motor (for 240vac) if you have that skill set, if not get help. i would not rewire in this situation.
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post #15 of 26 Old 02-26-2020, 08:32 AM
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It is past time to take that motor to a shop with experts.


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post #16 of 26 Old 02-26-2020, 01:04 PM
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Hypothetically, what if you flipped the blade around?
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post #17 of 26 Old 02-26-2020, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
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Hypothetically, what if you flipped the blade around?
It would be on backwards.
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post #18 of 26 Old 02-27-2020, 04:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankC View Post
You seem to be going in the right direction, I am not an electrician but I do know from experience that electric motors will spin when plugged in, however they may be running only on the starting windings and have no torque, bought a few like this at swap meets.



Something has happened to cause your motor to run in reverse, probably best to figure out what before you let out the smoke.


Too late for that. Oops! Ill explain below. :(


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Steve in Dahlonega
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post #19 of 26 Old 02-27-2020, 04:27 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimPa View Post
does it spin in reverse at full power and speed from what you can tell? my guess is that you did lose one leg of the power. it could be the switch, capacitor, or?? you will need to check the power at the motor (for 240vac) if you have that skill set, if not get help. i would not rewire in this situation.


It does not spin at full power. Ill explain below.


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Steve in Dahlonega
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post #20 of 26 Old 02-27-2020, 04:36 PM Thread Starter
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Did my Delta 36-725 die?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeC View Post
It is past time to take that motor to a shop with experts.


George


DING DING DING DING !! Tell us what he won Vanna!! (Cue Wheel of Fortune Music)

I received and replaced both capacitors today. My wife was witnessing so shed see she married not only a good looking, great all around guy, but a superhero who can build and fix everything!! The saw started (backwards), made a POP and CRACKLE and started smoking. Big time.

Called Delta Customer Service, again. The guy remembered me from a week ago and was puzzled by the POP and CRACKLE. Spinning backwards, after replacing the capacitors, he thinks it might be the centrifugal switch.

Time to remove the motor and take it somewhere or replace it. Or replace the table saw for a 1 3/4 or 3 HP cabinet saw.


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Steve in Dahlonega
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