Bandsaw blade Issue - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum
 
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post #1 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 10:50 AM Thread Starter
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Bandsaw blade Issue

I have a 14" Steel City Bandsaw and have an issue with the blade. I know about tracking and having the blade gullet near the middle of the crown but when I spin the top wheel, the blade on the bottom wheel creeps to the outside edge of the band and wheel. So much so it almost comes off the wheel. I've tried it with several other blades and widths with the same result. I've checked to make sure the wheels are coplanar and the guides are not pushing the blade out. Anyone have any ideas? Thanks.
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post #2 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 11:39 AM
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Is this a new problem or has it always done this? Does it happen with other blades? If it's not new, just a guess but because the blade on the bottom tracks to one edge, the bottom wheel needs to get shimmed (or unshimmed) in that direction. Try tracking the top wheel in the other direction, does the bottom follow? If it stabilizes in the new spot, you probably need to shim.

Does the manual have procedures for checking and adjusting the wheels? If so, I'd work through that.

Last edited by PhilBa; 08-21-2015 at 11:50 AM.
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post #3 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 12:17 PM Thread Starter
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It does it with old and new blades. I've tried tracking and the bottom does follow the top out. And to get the bottom gullets near the center the top of the blade is running off the back of the wheel. Tried it with 3/4" blades and 3/8" blades, same result. Does the bottom have to be centered when the top is, or is it supposed to be near the front of the wheel when the top is centered? Can't find that answer in the owner's manual. Thanks again.
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post #4 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 12:33 PM
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Have you watched this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=wGbZqWac0jU

Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something -Plato

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post #5 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 12:45 PM
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the wheels should not be ...

According to the famous You Tube Alex Snodgrass, the wheels should not need to be shimmed ..."don't mess with the wheels".

Here's what I'd like to know.
The bottom drive wheel is not adjustable for tilt, only the top tracking wheel is. If you hold a long straight edge against the edges of the bottom wheel , where does it fall against the top wheel with the blade on? I will assume it misses by some amount say 1/8", that's OK.

Per the video, the only way to properly adjust a bandsaw is to remove the table, back out all the guides, throw a new blade on and start from there.
That way all the variables are eliminated. A blade that is welded crocked will not track right. A wheel that is not crowned right won't track right. A blade that's is too loose won't track right.

You said:
It does it with old and new blades. I've tried tracking and the bottom does follow the top out. And to get the bottom gullets near the center the top of the blade is running off the back of the wheel. Tried it with 3/4" blades and 3/8" blades, same result. Does the bottom have to be centered when the top is, or is it supposed to be near the front of the wheel when the top is centered? Can't find that answer in the owner's manual. Thanks again.

The bottom wheel is pretty much along for the ride, while the top wheel is the one that sets up everything else. Unless your saw is out of whack and someone has "messed with the wheels" there shouldn't be any thing you can't adjust out by adjusting the top wheel so the gulklets ride in the center of the tire.

Per the video the tires must be secured/glued on the wheel correctly or centrifugal force will spin the blades off.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #6 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 01:25 PM
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No the blade on the bottom wheel doesn't have to be centered but it's not ok if the blade is in danger of falling off (which is what you wrote earlier). The bottom wheel is more than just along for the ride - it's the driving wheel. The snodgrass video is good but it is possible the saw is misaligned and needs more than a tune up. How long have you had this saw and how old is it? You didn't say if this a new problem. Has it had any work done?
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post #7 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 03:13 PM Thread Starter
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The Blade

I put a new Highland Woodworking woodslicer blade on and the gullets on the top are middle of the tire but the bottom ones are off the wheel but most of the blade is on the tire. I took the table off, opened the doors and held a three foot yard stick against the wheels and both match up.
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post #8 of 17 Old 08-21-2015, 06:38 PM
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well, of course!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBa View Post
No the blade on the bottom wheel doesn't have to be centered but it's not ok if the blade is in danger of falling off (which is what you wrote earlier). The bottom wheel is more than just along for the ride - it's the driving wheel. The snodgrass video is good but it is possible the saw is misaligned and needs more than a tune up. How long have you had this saw and how old is it? You didn't say if this a new problem. Has it had any work done?
I meant in the adjustment process, of course. Anyone who doesn't know it's the driving wheel ought to get out from behind it and take the train or a taxi....

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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post #9 of 17 Old 08-22-2015, 08:34 AM Thread Starter
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I've had the saw for over five years and it seems the blade has always rode on the edge of the lower driving wheel. I've never had it in the shop for repairs because the nearest repair shop is at least 100 miles away. A major undertaking but might be the final solution.
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post #10 of 17 Old 08-22-2015, 09:22 AM
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I don't know the specific machine and I would suggest starting from the basics.Check all the bolts on the machine for tightness to begin with ;is the bottom wheel directly driven by the motor or is there a drive belt or two?I once had a call to look at a bandsaw that was shedding blades and it had several speeds via stepped pulleys and found that somebody had been moving the belts for a speed change but had moved one wheel belt drive too far for the opposite end.Since the belt was strong it actually distorted the frame until we moved it to the correct groove and normal service was resumed.Possibly because it was a dumb mistake,nobody ever owned up.

One other comment,rather than the gullet running in the middle of the top wheel,try centering the blade on the top wheel and see if it helps.If it still moves,try moving the guides well away and take the blade off then turn it inside out and replace it.If it moves to the opposite side of the wheel when you spin the machine by hand you should suspect a misaligned weld.
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post #11 of 17 Old 08-22-2015, 12:04 PM
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How did you check that the wheels are coplanar?
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post #12 of 17 Old 08-22-2015, 12:49 PM
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OK, so the saw has always been like that. Probably passed QC like that. I'd guess it is at the limit of what is (er, was) considered acceptable by Steel City.

When you did the coplanar check, did the straight edge touch two points on each wheel?

I agree with fareastern that a quick bolt-n-screw tightening and general sanity check is in order.

I don't think it matters whether it's the gullet (Alex Snodgrass's approach) or the more conventional middle of the blade that is running on the middle of the tire crown. The blade should run in a reasonably similar location on the bottom. I got curious and looked at my 14" griz - on the bottom the blade is running maybe 1/8" off from where the top is. Never had a problem.

One thing that I meant to ask about - you had a 3/4" blade on it. Not every 14" can handle a wide blade like that. I would expect that it might hang out over the wheel a little.

One possible approach - if the blade doesn't come off and it cuts just fine, accept it as a quirk of your machine and don't worry about it.
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post #13 of 17 Old 08-22-2015, 02:54 PM
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How's the condition of the tires? If the wheels are co-planer, the only thing left is that the crown on the tire isn't in the center of the wheel like it should be, throwing the blade off track

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post #14 of 17 Old 08-22-2015, 03:17 PM
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there are two schools of thought on co-planer wheels

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer1 View Post
How did you check that the wheels are coplanar?
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankC View Post
Have you watched this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGbZqWac0jU

Alex Snodgrass says they should NOT be co-planer.
Tracking gullet should be in the center of the upper wheel at 4:10
Factory set, not co-planer at 6:04. Do not mess with your wheels. They should not be in the same plane, but angle to eachother.

Grizzly says they should be:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxfZphxj2eM
Co-planer factory set at 1:30
Center tracking at 3:00 into the video
Co-planer at 4:00 into the video.
Co-planer diagram at 4:00 into the video.

If the saw is throwing off the blades, only then should you attempt to change the factory settings of the wheels.

I honestly do not know if my saws are co-planer or not, but I'm gonna run out to the shop and check.

The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)

Last edited by woodnthings; 08-22-2015 at 03:20 PM.
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post #15 of 17 Old 08-23-2015, 02:39 PM
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Tires are only six months old.
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post #16 of 17 Old 08-24-2015, 07:38 AM
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Just have to throw in my thought.
If you spend the time to make sure your wheels are co-planer, then, adjust the tracking, (which is "tilting the upper wheel), do you go back to square one and adjust to co-planer again?
I'm with Alex Snodgrass, leave well enough alone. It works!

Do like you always do,,,, get what you always get!!
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post #17 of 17 Old 08-24-2015, 08:32 AM
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my thoughts

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcp612 View Post
Just have to throw in my thought.
If you spend the time to make sure your wheels are co-planer, then, adjust the tracking, (which is "tilting the upper wheel), do you go back to square one and adjust to co-planer again?
I'm with Alex Snodgrass, leave well enough alone. It works!
If your blade tracks as suggested, gullets in the center of the upper wheel, I'll betcha the wheels are not co-planer.

A suggestion to check for co-planer wheels, without removing the table, make a checking fixture. Take a piece of 3/8" plywood with a good straight edge, about 16" wide and remove the area where the table sits but keep enough to touch the wheels top and bottom. Depending on the size of your saw, it may be 4 ft long maybe 6 ft long to reach. It should look like a very large "C", but without the clipped off corners:


The answer to your question will only be as detailed and specific as the question is detailed and specific. Good questions also include a sketch or a photo that illustrates your issue. (:< D)
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