mi77915

I have a small weekend project (poplar) that is near completion and was wondering if I need to use a conditioner prior to using a minwax oil stain? I am using "Early American" color stain and I do not want to stain the wood too dark. Could I "thin" the stain so it will not be so dark? If so, what would I use to thin it with? Any comments/suggestions would be a great help.

Thanks,

Tom

red

I would use a wood conditioner on poplar. It blotches just like pine.

Red

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clarionflyer

If you're using popular, you probably don't want to apply wet stain directly to the wood.
You need a pre-treatment for a couple of reasons.
Stain applied to raw popular will blotch. Plus pre-stain can help you find the correct tint.
This is just an example:
http://www.minwax.com/products/wood_...nditioner.html

The pre-stain will inhibit the blotchiness. Plus it will help you to keep reapplying the amount of stain to meet your color preference.

And I'm sorry to confuse you, but there are quite a few alternatives, too. If you can't find the color you're looking for:
Gel Stains work great (my favorite)
Plus more advanced techniques (dyes, oils, etc)

Ask the others about that . I just threw this in to keep you from applying stain to raw popular.

Al B Cuttn Wud

I just posted on another post regarding using danish oil. I am in the process of finishing cherry at the moment and was concerned with the finish causing a blotchy appearance. Instead of going with preconditioner or sand sealer, I went with the danish oil. Going the other route meant I would have to apply the preconditioner, a gel stain instead of the traditional liquid stain and some sort of clear finish. The danish oil route only requres applying the oil and is super easy to apply with a soft rag. I'm sold just after one use and think my days of staining may be a thing of the past.

JW_in_Indy

Let me start by saying that if you use "wood conditioner" by Minwax or other big box brands, you might as well just send your hard earned dollars to my paypal account or throw them away. Same thing if you use their crappy stains. You will be wasting your time with uneven, (still blotchy) results. First, to the necessity to pretreat poplar.... Poplar is quite difficult to get right. It's an excellent wood species for painting, but staining it is difficult if you want a clean looking stain job without the wild undulations in color absorbtion. You definitely need a wash coat (or pretreatment) but the big box brands just aren't very good. If you don't have top notch spray equipment and are familiar with dyes and lacquers, I find that a couple of wash coats of dewaxed shellac cut 50% with denatured alcohol goes a long way in reducing the blotchy nature of poplar.

Next, the quality of your stain will also affect the final results you get on poplar. If using an oil based product and brushing or wiping, the professional grade Sherwood products from Sherwin Williams http://oem.sherwin-williams.com/us/e..._wiping_stain/ are far superior to any big box brand. You can sometimes find them in their retail stores, but they normally only carry their Wood Classics line. Which again, is better than MW by a far margin, but not quite as good as the Sherwood. Another stain that I've found to be quite nice is made by General Finishes. http://www.generalfinishes.com/msds-...eet-062705.pdf Once you've tried a high quality stain, you will never go back to the junk at the big box stores. It's so much easier to work with and the end results are superior.

Once you get your staining done on poplar, before any finish coats, I always like to apply a couple of coats of dewaxed shellac. They really help in filling the pores on a porous wood like poplar and making the final finish coats a lot smoother. Shellac can then be topcoated with several thinned coats of oil conversion varnish or polyurethane giving your piece an incredibly smooth durable finish.

mi77915

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and comments!! I ALWAYS learn a lot from everyone here!!!!! Well, I did finish the project, using all Minwax products (I already had them on hand), their conditioner, stain and poly finish. Not too happy with the results!!!! This was the first time I used Poplar for any project, it might be my last. I'll just use this as a learning experience.

Tom

JW_in_Indy

Sorry to hear that Tom. A good stain/finish job especially on something like poplar, is a little more difficult than the TV commercials would lead you to believe.

hands made for wood

I would highly recommend using wood conditioner having stained poplar without conditioner it was very blotchy..

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God bless!
Levi

JW_in_Indy

Exactly what I said Levi.... but you do it with a wash coat of 50/50 dewaxed shellac and denatured alcohol. It is FAR superior to any big box brand "wood conditioner." In fact, the wood conditioner by MW is about the worst of the bunch.

With that being said, even with a couple of wash coats, when using any type of penetrating stain, you will still get some very minor blotching. The ONLY way I've seen Poplar with zero blotching is with the wash coats that I mentioned and then sprayed with a lacquer tinted with dye. A dye stain will not penetrate the wood like an oil stain does.

Gel stains can also work on Poplar and don't penetrate as much as oil or water based stains, but they tend to cover and hide the grain. That's where proper spray equipment and a dyed lacquer can make Poplar look absolutely fantastic. But, not everyone has that kind of equipment or the expertise to use it.

Basically, you will get a much nicer stain job on Poplar making and using your own "wood conditioner" in the shellac/alcohol blend, along with a high quality stain than you ever will with a big box brand if you don't have the equipment and expertise to spray it.

Then again, there are those that use MW wood conditioner and stain on Poplar and think it looks great in its still blotchy glory. To each his own....