Finishing with tung oil and paste wax - Woodworking Talk - Woodworkers Forum

 
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post #1 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
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Finishing with tung oil and paste wax

Hi,

I'm new to woodworking and needed some help.

I took a class over the weekend and we made a box, but have to finish it ourselves.

Its made out of quilted maple and has ebony splines in it.

I sanded down the rough edges and rounded them off. I am quite happy with the result.

A couple of things though:

1) the ebony splines leave some fine black sawdust that only spreads with the sandpaper onto the maple. How do I get this stuff off before I finish it?

2) On one part of the box, there appears to be what I can only call 'razor burn' on the wood. The saw that was used to cut it looks like it glazed that part up. How do I get rid of it?

3) What is the maximum thickness of sandpaper I should use before I put the tung oil so that I don't 'close the pores up' too much?

4) How many coats of tung oil do I put - how long do I wait between each coat, and how many layers of paste wax and how long between each? Tung oil is just applied with a rag - how do I apply the wax?

I was also alternatively thinking of using laquer. Can I use it with the tung oil? Do I still use the paste wax?

I don't want too glossy a finish, and don't want a visible, thick coat of anything on top of the wood. I have seem some finishes that look like they are laminated in a fine, transparent plastic - but obviously were just finished with something. I don't want this, I want to bring out all the character of the wood, deepen the tone, protect the wood somewhat, and perhaps have a slightly waxy/matt finishes for protection.

Thanks

Last edited by nijabhaava; 12-01-2010 at 02:50 PM.
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post #2 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 03:07 PM
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(1) the ebony splines leave some fine black sawdust that only spreads with the sandpaper onto the maple. How do I get this stuff off before I finish it?
If you have compressed air, blow it off.

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Originally Posted by nijabhaava View Post
(2) On one part of the box, there appears to be what I can only call 'razor burn' on the wood. The saw that was used to cut it looks like it glazed that part up. How do I get rid of it?
Sand it with 320X.

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(3) What is the maximum thickness of sandpaper I should use before I put the tung oil so that I don't 'close the pores up' too much?
I wouldn't go further than 180x.

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Originally Posted by nijabhaava View Post
(4) How many coats of tung oil do I put - how long do I wait between each coat, and how many layers of paste wax and how long between each? Tung oil is just applied with a rag - how do I apply the wax?
Use only 100% pure Tung Oil, not a "Tung Oil Finish". Thin the first application with mineral spirits 50%. Wipe on with a rag and wait about 15 minutes and wipe off. Wait about 3-4 days. Wipe on full strength and wait again to wipe off. Wait about a week. The longer you wait between applications the better. To get some build with Tung Oil you'll need 4-5 applications. Do not use wax. You can sand in between applications with 320x if it gets a bit rough, but wipe off all residue with a dry clean lint free rag.

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I was also alternatively thinking of using laquer. Can I use it with the tung oil? Do I still use the paste wax?
You can apply lacquer once the Tung oil has cured completely. I wouldn't use wax.










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post #3 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 03:16 PM Thread Starter
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Hi

Thanks for the quick response.

The dust gets 'into' or onto the maple. Neither compressed air, nor a rag nor naphta gets it off.


Yes, I ordered 100% pure tung oil off amazon.

I didn't realize that it would take so long to finish with it..I was kind of hoping to make a belated birthday gift of this for my stepmom. But I guess it is what it is. Id rather have a good finish than a quick gift.

Why not paste wax. Here are a few pictures of what they say to be a tung oil + paste wax finish, and it looks quite good to me http://www.flickr.com/photos/joec3/4...7594587074603/

http://forum.canadianwoodworking.com...ad.php?t=19266
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2170/...38da953062.jpg

What effect will lacquer add to it?

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If you have compressed air, blow it off.



Sand it with 320X.



I wouldn't go further than 180x.



Use only 100% pure Tung Oil, not a "Tung Oil Finish". Thin the first application with mineral spirits 50%. Wipe on with a rag and wait about 15 minutes and wipe off. Wait about 3-4 days. Wipe on full strength and wait again to wipe off. Wait about a week. The longer you wait between applications the better. To get some build with Tung Oil you'll need 4-5 applications. Do not use wax. You can sand in between applications with 320x if it gets a bit rough, but wipe off all residue with a dry clean lint free rag.



You can apply lacquer once the Tung oil has cured completely. I wouldn't use wax.










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post #4 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 03:35 PM
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The dust gets 'into' or onto the maple. Neither compressed air, nor a rag nor naphta gets it off.
Don't use any solvent to try to clean it. When first attempting to clear it the air blast should do it. That is a problem when light and dark woods are used together. You might try a vacuum hose up tight. Since you used naptha, you might not get it off. It's possible to create a "tint" when using a solvent like that.

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Why not paste wax. Here are a few pictures of what they say to be a tung oil + paste wax finish, and it looks quite good to me http://www.flickr.com/photos/joec3/4...7594587074603/

http://forum.canadianwoodworking.com...ad.php?t=19266
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2170/...38da953062.jpg
I just don't use wax for a few reasons:

* It precludes doing further finishing if necessary.

*Difficult to remove all traces of wax if need be.

*It doesn't offer any durability to the finish.

*It's a finish that will need maintenance (periodic re-waxing).

*I'm very anal about having or using any type of wax for any purpose in an area that any finishing is performed.

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What effect will lacquer add to it?
It could present that plastic look that you don't like.










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post #5 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 03:53 PM Thread Starter
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Oh, I was under the impression that wax would provide some protection from water and such. I will likely use this box for my shaving stuff so it will be near the basin and near water a lot.

What is wax finish used for then? It seems to be fairly popular, what is its advantage?

I would like to add something for protection and maybe a bit of a matte/'thicker' finish than just the oil itself, without lending a plastic layer or artificial look and feel to the wood. What would you recommend?

Thank you so much for your responses.

Edit: I am also considering watco danish oil as a finish. Would the process be similar to tung oil? does it offer greater protection?

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Don't use any solvent to try to clean it. When first attempting to clear it the air blast should do it. That is a problem when light and dark woods are used together. You might try a vacuum hose up tight. Since you used naptha, you might not get it off. It's possible to create a "tint" when using a solvent like that.



I just don't use wax for a few reasons:

* It precludes doing further finishing if necessary.

*Difficult to remove all traces of wax if need be.

*It doesn't offer any durability to the finish.

*It's a finish that will need maintenance (periodic re-waxing).

*I'm very anal about having or using any type of wax for any purpose in an area that any finishing is performed.



It could present that plastic look that you don't like.










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Last edited by nijabhaava; 12-01-2010 at 03:56 PM.
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post #6 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 03:57 PM
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I use maintenance free finishes, which would be a film type finish, but get the sheen that is appropriate for the piece, or as what the client wants.










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post #7 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 05:13 PM Thread Starter
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Ok, thanks

heres one more question

There was glue inside the seams in the joinery. I scraped alot of it off with a chisel or sometimes with a carving blade. But it has left some cavities in the joinery that doesn't look nice. Theres also some hard to get at glue left in the box. How would I get at this and fix or redress the joinery area so that it looks better?

Also, in the base of the box I have some scratches that won't go away with simple sandpapering for some reason. How do I get rid of them?


thanks again
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post #8 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 07:46 PM
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i wouldn't worry about the glue. even the stuff you scraped off is going to leave a stain. chalk it up to a learning curve. you won't see it untill you apply your 1st coat of finish. i've made a few boxes in my time. you don't need much glue at all. it's more about clamping than the amount of glue. when i join my boxes i run a flat bead and smooth with my finger evenly and less than mm deep. then there isn't much left to squish out of the joint. a trick i use is to keep the bead away from the edges, so with my finger i scrape the excess from edges and i have a small towel to wipe then i set up for clamping. believe it or not i have a 1000w 12" sub in a box i made out of 1/2" mdf for my van. all i used was wood glue. and a good fit. it's also a sealed box. it is a testement to how strong carpenters glue really is.

of all the things i have lost, i miss my mind the most
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post #9 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 08:51 PM
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Ok, thanks

heres one more question

There was glue inside the seams in the joinery. I scraped alot of it off with a chisel or sometimes with a carving blade. But it has left some cavities in the joinery that doesn't look nice. Theres also some hard to get at glue left in the box. How would I get at this and fix or redress the joinery area so that it looks better?

Also, in the base of the box I have some scratches that won't go away with simple sandpapering for some reason. How do I get rid of them?


thanks again
One fix you can try is with a very sharp chisel. If you use it bevel up and slide the flat side down towards the joint, you can pare off the glue. You'll get a feel for the correct angle by how the chisel slides effortlessly on the side, but makes contact with any glue build up.

The chisel has to have a perfect edge, no nicks, and a very keen straight edge.










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post #10 of 14 Old 12-01-2010, 10:39 PM
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[QUOTE=cabinetman;164796]One fix you can try is with a very sharp chisel. If you use it bevel up and slide the flat side down towards the joint, you can pare off the glue. You'll get a feel for the correct angle by how the chisel slides effortlessly on the side, but makes contact with any glue build up.

The chisel has to have a perfect edge, no nicks, and a very keen straight edge.


i tried that method. but i was still left with glue stains after applying my finish. my main material is plywood, i don't have much wiggle room for a chisel. i just learned to be less wastefull of my glue. my main problem with your method you might find strange, a million dollars could be on the table in front of me... and i still couldn't sharpen one... lol, i can sharpen everything else, just not a chisel. what i need is a chisel doctor!

of all the things i have lost, i miss my mind the most
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post #11 of 14 Old 12-02-2010, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabinetman

One fix you can try is with a very sharp chisel. If you use it bevel up and slide the flat side down towards the joint, you can pare off the glue. You'll get a feel for the correct angle by how the chisel slides effortlessly on the side, but makes contact with any glue build up.

The chisel has to have a perfect edge, no nicks, and a very keen straight edge.




.
A small chisel plane works well. Set up properly, it will remove glue squeeze out and high spots, while skimming the wood.
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post #12 of 14 Old 12-03-2010, 03:10 PM
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Was in a similar situation a while back. Got some good advice. Look up the thread "How would you finish this?"
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post #13 of 14 Old 12-04-2010, 11:03 PM
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Thanks for the post and responses, folks.
Good finishing advice.
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post #14 of 14 Old 12-05-2010, 01:18 AM
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A small chisel plane works well. Set up properly, it will remove glue squeeze out and high spots, while skimming the wood.

Don't ya just love those little planes? Looks like a 'Cyclops Bunny'.

Harrison, at your service!
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