b4d93r

I just discovered this thing called a ShopSmith, looks pretty cool and seems to do the tasks of many different tools, definatly a shop space saver. I was wondering what your thoughts on them are. Are they a worthy investment?

rrbrown

This has been discussed on here numerous times with mixed results. I personally don't like the shopsmith and passed on getting one with all attachments for $300.00 but you will find some who love them. I think most would prefer individual tools but you can look at the link below for other post on this subject. I'm sure this has been discussed several times but I only found this one old post.

Shopsmith - Good or Bad?

__________________
Semper Fi
Richard

Once A Marine Always A Marine.

Some choose to study history, but Marines choose to create history.

rrich

In a single sentence...

If you have more time than working space, a Shopsmith may be a good investment.

__________________
Use the right tool for the job.

Rich (Tilting right)
Huntington Beach, California
Remember that when we have the "BIG ONE" everything east of the Rockies falls into the ocean.

clementfeme

I for one am very pleased with my SS500. I have had in operation since 1985. I have inserted a Thin kerf , 7 1/2 in blade on it and use it for small cuts both cutoffs and ripping. Have just installed the Lift assist adaptor on it, and with the current ballance that I have, I can go from Horiz. to vertical Drill press mode with two Fingers. I have since purchased two table saws, two radial Arms, two 6 in. jointers, and a Sears floor Drill press. I have also purchased a Sears chop saw, and a 12 in. planer.

But I am very pleased with the shop smith. Best regards to all.

Clement

b4d93r

Thanks for the link rrbrown, I did a search and found lots of stuff where people mentioned the Shopsmith but I didn't see that post. I think my biggest interest is the options of the drill press and lathe. The table saw part I'm not sure about. I have an issue with the smaller design table saws, I just picture having issues with large 4x8 sheets. I guess thats why most people build a table to set the saw in.

A lot of it has more to do with shop space. I haven't had a chance to fully measure the garage but in essence its a two car garage without the second door. I feel I have enough room but if something like the Shopsmith could help free up a little space that would be cool. But I'm also thinking that by the time I save up enough to get the Shopsmith I will probably be able to aquire each piece. guess thats why I'm researching it. :)

cabinetman

What you understand about size and space you'll see whatever limitations the SS has. Some small spaces can benefit from folding tables that will form a surround for a table saw when in use.

The ability of horizontal drilling is unique to the SS.

rrbrown

I have a few problems with the Shopsmith. I never used the lathe but know someone that has and he said there's a work height problem ( to low I think). I know the table saw is two high and can easily put your arm in the danger zone. The Drill Press and horizontal drilling are the best features. I have a Friend with one that he got used for $200 and it takes time to switch between tools, and allot of the work heights are two low or two high. For the most part his collects dust. I would invest in individual tools it would be cheaper then a new Shopsmith for sure. You can find other ways to save space if needed. Just my .02

__________________
Semper Fi
Richard

Once A Marine Always A Marine.

Some choose to study history, but Marines choose to create history.

b4d93r

I'll probably go the route of individual tools. I'm pretty sure I have more than enough room for the primary tools (tablesaw, drill press, Router/router table, planer, and my mitersaw station) plus have room in the corner for car/motorcycle work. Most of the car stuff is basic maintenance which can be done in the driveway but will probably dedicate more to the bike.

I think what brought this on was the overwhelming feeling I got the other day when I was just trying to find something in the garage. Currently its just piled up with junk. The garage (soon the become a shop) will go through a major transformation/clean up when I get started on it. I actually got a good look at the "attic" portion (if you want to call it that) and the room is somewhat limited but will work good for straight out storage. We also have a small shed built off to the side which I'll also clean up and start storing the garden/yard stuff in.

I figure my biggest pieces will be the table saw and workbench that's apart from the counters/work areas along the walls. I'm planning on setting up the table saw in a way I can better manage and cut 4x8s from either side. It won't be massively huge and i'll have some portable support items but it will be big enough to make managing the sheets/boards more safe.

daxinarian

I envy you... a space the size of a two car garage would be double what I currently have...
To give you an idea of what you can fit in one stall, I have a table saw, band saw, router table, oscillating spindle belt sander, cyclone seperator dust collector, 9" metal lathe, compound sliding miter saw, planer, benchtop drill press, two workbenches, and plenty of wood storage. It is a bit cramped, especially trying to cut 4x8 sheets of plywood.
I guess what I am trying to say is, space will not be an issue in a two car garage for quite a while... Jut remember, no matter how much room you have, you will continue to buy tools until you run out of room, then you will buy 3 more

clarionflyer

Let's say:
table saw $700-$1500
drill press $200-$600
lathe $300-$1200
sand table $100-$500

That's $1300 to $3800
Most would consider me generous with these prices between low and medium grade equipment (yes?).
My shop is at the end of my garage. Roughly 12x26'.
(If I need the room, I pull the cars out - then I have 36x26')
But in my 12x26":
I have an additional:
jointer
miter saw with a 10 ft table
router and table (I do want to upgrade the table)
etc.

All for cheaper than the cost of the ShopSmith.
I'm 100% for the success of the ShopSmith, but for me, the numbers don't add up.

b4d93r

I know right now I'm not correctly estimating the amount of space I have now mostly because, as I mentioned before, the garage is full of junk just piled up and I haven't had a change to truly measure it.

In the basic designs I've drawn out, I haven't really considered the size ratio of everything either. I know my miter saw station (in the drawings) take up the majority of the west wall and I know thats not necessarily true. Plus I haven't fully decided on if I'm going to build a portable station for it or leave it in one place.

I don't have a lot of tools yet just a Jig, miter and scroll saw and a cordless power drill but I'm also doing shop pre-planning for the others. But thats part of the fun! I do know that the wish list contains a table saw, Drill press (haven't decided on bench or stand), planer and I'll be starting with a hand router. Still not sure about a bench router, haven't figured out the uses for that quite yet.

I do need to get somewhere that has some of those tools and actually look at them, that will help me with the size ratio issue. I'm mostly starting with cheaper stuff cause there's no way I could survive the trouble I'd get into if I bought a $1000 + piece of equipment right now! However, as my skills increase I'll upgrade.

shopsmithtom

If you haven't done any major buying yet, maybe my 2 cents will be useful. I have 4 shopsmiths in my shop. (Yeah, I know it kinda defeats the space savings of a combo tool, but I'm sort of a "Smith" junkie. Here's why. I learned woodworking from my dad on the shopsmith he bought new in about 1952. I still use that machine. I have another 1952 (these were the earlier model before the current Mark 5) a 1957 and a 1983 Mark 5. The most I've ever had to do to them was to put a set of bearings into either a motor or headstock, not from use, but from the previous owner letting it sit too many years & the bearing grease congealed. They run forever. As to change over time, it seems that the guys who actually own them are not the ones that grumble about it, it's those who don't own one & imagine it's a problem. Most changeover's take less than one minute. (really)
I won't make a strong case for it's table saw (although it's always been fine for me) so if big table/tilt arbor is a must, get a separate table saw, but the shopsmith is a great variable speed lathe (didn't realize there was a height issue) great horizontal borer, drill press and 12" disk sander, all in a small space. Their jointer & bandsaw(which never needs adjustment) are first rate and while some will say they are small, I've biult a ton of stuff & they met my needs.
Now, obviously, I'm a bit biased here, but I've used them all my life & love them. (also tried separate tools)
If you haven't gotten anything yet, you might want to consider a used Smith. Craigslist is a good starting point & you should be able to get a good set up for $300 -$500. The last mark 5 I found for a friend cost $50. and some new bearings & cleanup...all done for under $100. & I'm not even in a big metro area where there's a big selection. If you have questions, feel free to PM me. Obviously, I love to talk about this.

Gene Howe

I've used a ShopSmith for 30 years. Very satisfied and have absolutely no problems with change over time. It's a great horizontal borer, lathe (no problems with height for this 6 footer), 12" disk sander and very accurate drill press. The table is a little small, but aux tables (which most build for any sized table) fix that problem. As for price. used ones are available for $3-500 and it's very simple to work on if it needs it. The bandsaw is superb, as well.

I wouldn't trade mine for all stand alone machines I could buy for even the high cost of a new Shop Smith. The quality trade off just wouldn't be worth it to me.

b4d93r

Hey Shopsmithtom thanks for the reply and input.

I haven't done any purchasing yet as my financial adviser (a.k.a the fiance') has me on a "No bailout for you freeze".

With just getting started in woodworking, I don't know what all tools I would need on a regular basis other than a table saw, and router all the others are "exotics". Why do I need a drill press when you can do the same with a hand drill and a steady hand? Why do I need a joiner other than it looks cool. That type of stuff. It's mostly because I haven't built or had a project where those things would have come in handy and this is why the shopsmith appeals to me.

It has all the things that a person starting out needs and is in one convenient package. I do agree with those that say you don't need it as the independent/individual stations are nice as well. But for me, maybe thats the future? My fiance' wants me to do all these "chores" and I don't have all the tools I need or the space at the moment so a Shopsmith fits right in with my current needs. I can set it up in the driveway and start working away. I beleive I've mentioned before but I am a little nervous about table saws in the fact that most of the area the table is is small and ripping 4x8 is what gets me. But I do understand that this is a skill and there are options to making it safer such as extentions and such.

I have access to one, one of my coworkers has one with all the accessories (bandsaw ect.). He bought is several years ago and never even took it out of its boxes. He's an older gentlemen and a really nice guy so I'm going to talk to him about a price. He's willing to do payments (He does know where I work! LOL) which definately fits into my budget. Now I just need to get approval from the financial manager!

Well, my carpool is here and it's time to head to work! Have a great day everyone!

shopsmithtom

As to whether there is a need for certain tools, that's a real subjective question, but here's my take on it. (it's a good thing opinions are free & worth every penny) I've never been good enough to drill perfectly square (or specific angle) holes, so the drill press is the accurate way to go. (By the way, if you get a Shopsmith & don't get a copy of "Power Tool woodworking for Everyone" with it, go to ebay & get one. It'll cost $10-20 & be worth a ton more in usefulness. It shows how to set up simple jigs on the shopsmith to do amazing things you never even thought you could do.
As to usefulness of the jointer, a "jointed" glue joint is a better & less visable joint than the best sawn (is that the right word?) one. The thing I have found is that (& I've always gotten used stuff from craigslist, ebay or private parties) once I have an accessory, I find tons of uses for it.
That book, by the way, might be a good purchase even before you would buy a Shopsmith just to give you some ideas of the potential of all the setups. Also, if you're looking for some guidance on prices, models almost anything, I guess, and don't want to run it through the forum, feel free send me a personal message. I'll help if I can.
By the way, for your fiance's benefit, I remodeled an entire kitchen, bedroom & living/dining room at my lake place using my Shopsmith...tell her how much she'll benefit from your investment, too.

Gene Howe

"By the way, for your fiance's benefit, I remodeled an entire kitchen, bedroom & living/dining room at my lake place using my Shopsmith...tell her how much she'll benefit from your investment, too."

You are a sly old dog. But it works!

b4d93r

LOL True! I have used that or similar angles before but it doesn't get to far. She has this thing of if the checking account drops below $500 she starts freaking out. Now before you say "Dang you gotta be rich!" we're not, she's just that good about budgeting our finances.

It's also funny as she knows I want to do things like that and she wants them to but if the budget doesn't allow it then it doesn't allow anything and this is an area I need to work.

"So we can afford to upgrade the kitchen now, but should we spend half the budget on tools when we are able to do it and then not be able to do what we wanted because half of it was spent on tools? Or should we spend a little at a time now on tools that way when we are ready to remodel the kitchen, we have more to spend on that? If I buy the Shopsmith now and make payments, we can still save for the remodel."

I think that logic may work. Plus my co-worker is willing to take payments. So what are your guys thoughts on a fair offer. He has everything and it cost him $2500 originally and it's all still in the box, never used. I was thinking $800 as I want to be fair but I also want a reasonable price the fiance' will feel comfortable with.

shopsmithtom

$800 may or may not be a fair price. If you find out the serial #, you can go to the Shopsmith site & learn the year it was made. This will help for value. Also, find out if it is a model 500, 510 or 520. This will effect the value big time.

Then ask if it includes any optional SPT's. (supplimental power tools) Things like the bandsaw or jointer included would be very good. Just knowing what he paid isn't enough to be useful. Paying full retail for a new one (while I believe it's worth it in the long run) is not nesessary when there are so many good used deals around. Letting you make payments might sound attractive, but only if the price is not more than market value for used stuff...maybe a little higher is OK for the convenience.

As a side bar, if you do this & make payments, even if he is a friend or co-worker, or neighbor, have an egreement in writing sighed by both parties laying out just EXACTLY what the terms are. That might sound picky, but it's best in the long run.

If you get more details on the machine, feel free to ask me anything. I'll be glad to give my opinion on values of used stuff. I've bought, rebuilt & sold many Shopsmiths, so I'll be glad to give the benefit of that experience. Also, check out craigslist in your area. It's been a great source for me. -SST

bbjornstad

A while back I inherited a Magna (MonkeyWards?) Mark VII. it must have sat for years, and i have been trying to get it going for sometime. the motor hums, but nothing turns. I got a manual online and i think i read where you you do not shut it down at HI\LO? RPM because it has a hard time with next start-up? How does one determine if the Headstock is worth rebuilding($$) or replacing($$$)? I saw recently where someone had just removed the headstock and replaced\attached with a plain motor. it had a pulley with 3 dia's and another attached to the spindle with 3 offset 3 dia's, and they just moved the belt from one dia to the other to change speed. I can do that... although I will have to fabricate a plate for the motor..

shopsmithtom

There are a couple of issues a work here. First, the machine you mention, a Mark VII is kind of a "one off" machine. They were a short production machine with a reversible motor & drive system unlike the early 10er's and the Mark V that makes up the bulk of Shopsmith production. Parts for that machine are relatively rare as they didn't make all that many. The high speed shut down/startup issue is largely overstated as a problem if the machine is in good running order, it's kinda like starting to drive w/ a manual transmission set in high gear to start. On an unused machine (keep in mind that a Mark VII dates to 1960) so the grease in the bearings has had almost a half century to dry up and/or congeal) there's usually just too much internal drag in the machine to start running. If the drive system is intact, what you'll probably need to do is put new bearings in the upper & idler shafts & maybe also the motor. If you're handy & mechanical, you can do it yourself & bearings will cost between $25 & about $80.00 depending whether you use Chinese or US made. Some Chinese sources are fine, by the way. Before you do this, you should make sure there are no stripped gears in the variable speed drive set up. If it were me, I'd part it out on ebay. The other setup you described actually sounds like a model 10er headstock with the exposed motor & 3 step pulleys & not compatible to your stuff. You might want to go to the Shopsmith website & click Mark V & look at the history of the machine. I may have other resources & if you PM me we can pursue those.