lobos3737

I'm just starting out and bought a table saw from Sears (http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...ame=Table+Saws). Turns out the saw is junk. The fence doesn't lock straight, the miter guage is sloppy, the miter slot is non-standard etc etc. Sears will take it back but at this point I can only get a store credit. Am I foolish to consider another craftsman saw? Does anyone have any experience with this one (http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...e=Table+Saws)? Should I just stay away from craftsman altogether?

I can't really afford to invest more the a few hundred more on top of the store credit that I'll get for the saw I'm returning.

I'm thinking what I should probably do is hold onto the store credit and just buy a used contractor saw off of craigslist after the holidays.

Any advice you can off would be welcome.

Anybody selling a nice contractor saw in the Boston/RI area would be more welcome.

-Rich

GeorgeC

I have had a craftsman saw for many years and it has been a very good piece of equipment, except for the original fence and miter gauge.

My saw was one of the less expensive of their saws when I purchased it 25 years ago and came with the fence and miter guage being cheap. Over the years I used the miter guage very little and recently purchased a very good Rockler sled.

Many years ago I bought a good fence from Sears. This is one of the better fences that I have seen. You have to keep your fence track areas and the fence itself clean on any saw. If not you will run into problems with square locking.

I have not seen the two saws that you reference in the store. From the price of the first one I would expect it to be very lax on tolerances. I would not expect the miter slow to be non-standard. How have you determined it is non-standard?

The second saw I would just not care for.

Overall Craftsman makes very good tools. All of the major powered tools in my shop are Craftsman. However, like any brand you must be selective in what you get. The low price end is usually not very good.

I do not have personal experience with anything of the new larger tools on the market. I do know I was looking at the saws in our local Lowes the other day and would not have any of them.

George

Woodchuck1957

A Contractors saw would definatly be a big step up, and there are a few really good deals on used ones out there that would be in your price range if you know what your looking for and are very patient. But, if you need a saw right away and are very limited on space, perhaps this http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...ame=Table+Saws is a saw you may want to strongly consider, it's rated pretty highly for a jobsite saw. The price on it at Sears is a little high, you can pick one up just about anywhere for $369. If it is something you think you would like, I would bring the price issue up with the people at your local Sears store, I bet they will come down in price if you push the issue. I don't know what you do now for woodworking and what your future plans are in woodworking, or how much room you have in your shop for equipment, or your knowledge of saws if you do look for a used Contractors saw, so it's hard for me to know what you really need or want for a tablesaw.

bradnailer

I would take the saw back for the store credit and pick up a better named contractors saw like a Delta or Jet. You can always use the store credit to pick up some name brand power tools at Sears like Dewalt Porter Cable and Hitachi. If you end up doing much wood working you will probably be in the market for a plate jointer, router and an extra drill. Plus, Sears usually has a decent stock of clamps and accessories.

There's nothing more frustrating than trying to work with a poorly designed tool. I will probably get flamed but I have not had good luck with Rigid woodworking tools sold at Home Depot.

99flhr

In a sense the OP is correct.
Sears & Ridgid use a .746 bar and a .750 slot
The other major manufacturers supply a .750 bar and .755 slot

knotscott

Craftsman is just a brand name, and like many brands, they have some clunkers and some very good tools. Their hybrid table saws from Orion (Steel City) are excellent, as are their Orion jointers, DPs, and Rikon clone bandsaws. Their older contractor saws were made by Emerson, then Ryobi and are the basis for the current Ridgid TS3650/TS3660. The Craftsman 22124 hybrid has standard miter slots that will accept any aftermarket miter gauge or jig on the market. The first saw you bought is a mediocre class of saw regardless of brand name or who makes it....it's a class that many of us have learned a harsh lesson with....it's just barely capable of basic work and leaves alot to be desired for precision woodworking. The 2nd saw you listed (model 21829) is actually a clone of the Ryobi BT3100...it has a sliding miter table, a router table, and is mounted to a roll away base. The BT3100 and it's predecessor BT3000 have large loyal following and a website called BT3Central that can help with any setup questions or problems. The BT isn't necessarily for everyone but it's capable of good work and is a significant step up from the cheapy model you returned. It's worth checking out, and the current sale price is pretty good.

With that said, the BT gives up some size and mass to the bigger cast iron saws, but those also tend to fall in a higher price range.

Another option is to sell your Sears store credit to someone else and parlay the proceeds to a different saw.

djonesax

It’s all about the right tool for the job. In my opinion you won’t find a GOOD saw for $200. Maybe and OK saw… But for $500 you won’t get an awesome saw either. As my first saw, I bought a very similar saw that you purchased and took it back. I had all the same problems as you. For some people and depending on what they are doing that $200 may have been fine but I wanted something that would allow me to work on more projects. Mine was a floor model and fully assembled. It was so light, I loaded it on the truck my self. I could pick it up and carry it around no problem. I am surprised I didn’t kill my self using it. I tried to put a 4x8 sheet of ¼ inch ply on it the saw nearly tipped over. That was stupid on my part but after that I took it back and got something with some weight. I have the Rigid TS3660 now and love it.

From my research these were good saws for the $500 price point

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100399036

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100608588

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=159372-46578-C10FL&lpage=none


In the portables my uncle has this and likes it a lot.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100090444


I decided to purchase new versus used because I had never owned a table saw before and I didn’t feel comfortable learning how to tune a saw on something used. The rigid was in perfect tune straight out the box. It took 6 hours to assemble though.

David

dbhost

I can suggest the BT clone the 21829, and it is currently on sale at Sears for $399.00, I'd grab one for sure. The saw you posted is a Sears labeled BTS-16. NOT Ryobi's best saw. Yes the miter slot is NOT standard sized. That is pretty typical of Craftsman branded stuff. I think it is something goofy like 11/16 wide instead of 3/4". Just enough to be annoying. And honestly, for $200.00 I wouldn't expect an accurate miter gauge.

The 21829 though is a VERY accurate saw, and as posters above have mentioned, the folks at BT3Central can help you with any issues that are peculiar to that saw. (I use a BT3100, the 21829 has some minor improvements other than the red paint).

For what it's worth, the predecessor to the 21829 was the 22811, and there is a member on BT3Central I think is in your area selling a VERY clean, low use 22811 for cheap... His photo looks like it could be a Craftsman promo pic...

__________________
-- Trying to follow the example of the master...

knotscott

Rich - Here's a used Ridgid 3612 in your area. It was the last of the American made Emerson contractor saws, and is the predecessor to the TS3650. Many felt that this was the best model they ever produced. At $400, I think it's a bit on the high side, but is a solid saw that appears to have been well cared for by an honest to goodness woodworker. Maybe he'll throw in a couple of blades to sweeten the deal.

Woodchuck1957

Nevermind.

knotscott

What I'd do?

Woodchuck1957

Nothing Scott, I posted, then realized it wasn't correct info. My mistake.

clarionflyer

All good responses. But you asked if Sears builds a good saw. Actually I don't think THEY build anything .
But, their top-end saws are superb.

I have the saw posted below. This is, truly, an outstanding saw and I've made a review buried, somewhere, under the "Review" topic. Anything less than a commercial shop should find this saw outstanding (I think they would appreciate it, too). The more I use it, the more I admire it. It does everything. I can only imagine that, as you go higher on the Sears list, the saws only get better.
Mine has a "Sears" fence (not sure who makes it), but it has attachment slots for anything you can imagine and works slick as can be. I can't think of anything the Biesemeyer has on it (but I'm sure I'll have a few argues on that).

I've noticed the price has gone up quite a bit in the stores. But online, it's still $712. The (free) Craftsman Club used to offer it for the low $600's.

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00922114000P

Hope it helps.

knotscott

Oh well....I'll see if can step in it later!

top

i have had a craftsman saw for a long time "years" never had any trouble don't buy low end tools pay the cost and be the boss i have the model no. 315.228510 craftsman saw you can see it in my pic


"THE SHOP OF TOP"

Handyman

Bring the saw back and demand your money back. If you were talking about an old craftsman saw I would go to bat with you on keeping it. I have dealt with sears a few times and I if you are demanding enough, they will accommodate you.

__________________
Collector of Old Tools
Fixer of all things broke
Expert = Drip under pressure

lobos3737

I brought the saw back to sears today and they took it back with no problems. I'm on the hunt for a new saw now while I do a little saving. I'm hoping to pick up something right after the holidays.

Thank you for all the advice so far and feel free to leave more if you have some.

Woodchuck1957

Well it will certainly give you enough time to shop around and find out what it is you want. Look for one with a Biesemeyer fence, or Unifence, or Delta T2, or Vega fence, etc. Other than that, I think I'm all advised out on this one. Goodluck.

Gus Dering

You can always keep your eye on Criegslist for a good cabinet saw. With the time frame you are talking about I'd bet you can stay in budget and get yourself a good Unisaw or equal. The key to used equipment is patience and diligence. Gotta be ready to go with the cash and the truck. But the deals come up from time to time.

Nothing beats a really good table saw. Start with the best you can.

dbhost

I second the Craigslist plug. I picked up a 4 year old drill press that had an original retail price of $419.00 on it for $75.00. Just can't complain about that deal...

Those Emerson built Ridgids and Craftsmans are really something to look for. You should be able to snag a near mint condition 1.5HP contractors saw for $200.00 IF you are patient and hit it just right...

__________________
-- Trying to follow the example of the master...